Muse

And y'all's on. hello everybody and we are live some people waited for this for a very long time john

and i am so pleased to do this and you know what lizzie this is you've given me an opportunity here to make kind of a big announcement too if oh amazing amazing i can't wait so we'll get to

the big announcement first i want to introduce you uh for people who do not know this is john John Kiriakou, former CIA officer, my favorite CIA officer and a good friend of mine. I respect John very, very much. He got famous when he blew the whistle on CIA's torture program. He had the guts to do it when others didn't, and he went to prison for it, which was a terrible experience. I personally know how much suffering he had to endure because of this agency. But today we're going to talk about not just the CIA and its shenanigans, but also Mossad, Israel and many more. so guys you will also get to ask John directly questions whatever you want to know and he'll be here to answer them we'll get to super chat at the end of the show now John let's start with

the announcement so I am starting a new podcast called John Kiriakou's briefing room it is going to be on YouTube. If you go to Real John Kiriakou, that's the page. We're going to start it in the next four weeks, and it will be sort of the new improved reboot of Deep Focus. It's going to be much more professionally done, in-depth conversations and explanations of things going around the world. I'm very, very proud of it. Amazing. I can't wait to watch. Isn't it crazy

that our conversation has to happen live while we're doing a show when we used to just call each other on the phone and chat? Like now it's this, but that's what makes it so natural, right? So we

can talk. And I got to say, Lizzie, every time you talk, I learned something because you go so deep into these issues. And I've, I found myself quoting you with some frequency. Oh, the same

right so let's start with uh a new development you just told me before we went live that the guy that almost killed you got out of prison explain to people what happened who he killed how you survived accidentally and the entire story we like stories yeah yeah i'm very upset

about this very to the point where i've actually lost sleep over this so greece the the whole country of Greece was the collective victim of a terrorist group called Revolutionary Organization 17 November. 17 November was active between 1975 and 2002, and they launched hundreds of attacks in that period. They killed 28 people, including the CIA station chief, Richard Welch, two American defense attaches, a hapless African-American Air Force technical sergeant who was just doing his laundry, not bothering anybody. And they walked in and just shot him dead. And they killed the Turkish ambassador, the Turkish deputy ambassador, the British defense attache, the Greek minister of communications, the Greek minister of finance, the Greek governor of the central bank, a number of Greek newspaper publishers, just a vicious, violent, murderous, Stalinist terrorist group. The group was broken up, disrupted in 2002 by the Greek National Police, and they were all arrested. The masterminds, five of them, Alexandros Yotopoulos, a guy known as the Black Hand, Dimitris Koufodinas, and three brothers, the Xeros brothers, remained in prison. they were sentenced to 1,765 years in prison, which in Greece means 20 years. So when the 20 years was up in 2022, there was talk of releasing these guys. The American embassy jumped up and down and lost their shit, and the paroles were put aside. Well, Jotopoulos.

Again, the mastermind of this group and of all of its assassinations was released three days ago. As we're speaking, he's out free, having a coffee and a cigarette, hanging out with his friends.

Wow.

This hurts me very much. In 2000, the year 2000, when I was stationed in Greece, 17 November murdered my next door neighbor, the british defense attache stephen saunders now what they would do almost all the time they would just drop a manifesto at the site of the of the attack there is a backstory i want from you though

i remember this because i think the first time you told me this story is when i visited you in washington dc right and stephen saunders was the guy who told you john you're so paranoid like you know americans are so paranoid and then he got killed and maybe like tell us this story and

yeah yeah yeah poor steven steven listen the downside of steven saunders steven was a brigadier general one star general in the british army with the british defense attache and steven was a media whore he any time there was a camera he would jump right in front of it and smile and give an interview and it was all great he he loved the camera the camera loved him he was a good looking guy, lovely wife, two young daughters. They're grown women now. And so he moved in next door to me. Well, not next door, our backyard's abutted. And so we were at a dinner one night. It was the evening of the day that I had gotten a new car. I had gotten a fully armored BMW 540 because Greece was so dangerous. We were always in danger of being assassinated in our cars. So the CIA bought me this fully armored BMW 540. It was the first 540 in Greece. We couldn't even register it with an insurance company. We had to buy insurance in Germany. But I needed that big 400cc engine to carry all that armor right so that night we're at a we're at a uh a dinner and i'm standing i'm standing with steven with the french defense attache and the american defense attache who was a friend of mine and steven was making fun of me in a joking fun way because of my car and he said, you Americans, you're so paranoid. He goes, this is an EU country. It's a NATO country. What are you so afraid of? And everybody laughed. And I said, I said, you Brits live in a dream world. If you think that because they have pretty beaches and palm trees, that they're not going to kill you if they have the chance believe me if they have the chance they're gonna kill you and two weeks later they killed him yeah several months passed they didn't they didn't leave a manifesto at that attack and so several months passed and i went into the office one day it was august uh 16th 2000 and my boss runs into my office and he says did you see the manifesto I said, what manifesto? And he said, the 17 November manifesto on Saunders. And I said, they didn't, they didn't drop a manifesto. And he said, no, they, they issued it today. They sent it to one of the leftist newspapers. I said, no, I didn't hear anything about it. And,

and he says, they mentioned you. I said, me, what do they say? And he showed it to me and it said, It said, we saw the big spy, but we knew he was armed and he was driving an armored car. So we elected to carry out the revolutionary sentence on the war criminal Saunders. And he said, you've got to go. And they drove me straight to the airport. And I took the, with my family, picked up my family and two other cars. My kids, I just dropped my kids off at school. and um and they they flew us back to the states and that was the end of it but crazy but the group was finally destroyed and these these evil men were finally brought to justice but greece is the only country in the european union that has a statute of limitations on murder it's 20 years And so one of the shooters in the Richard Welch assassination, Yanis Serifis, off scot-free because 20 years had passed and he hadn't participated in any other murders. We got all the rest of them. They got 1,765 years, which really means 20. And in this case meant 24. Yes. And now they're free to go. I'm really angry about this.

That's crazy. Well, I mean, yeah, there's a lot to be angry about today in the world. And we will dive into some of this stuff you know i i remember you told me once that uh you truly got to know the cia is the the at the deep state of the cia the part yeah we call deep state when you actually got out when you were in i'm guessing you were just so dialed in and focused on exactly like compartmentalized agencies so like you had whatever you were doing and never really looked around right so tell me that revelation in your head like okay so you learned oh shit my agency is actually doing this and this and this so uh tell me what happened you know what it started just

before i left and i'll give you one example i worked in what we call the bullpen in the counterterrorism center there must have been 150 cubicles set up to the point where there were so many people working in the bullpen with private offices all around the perimeter the director of of counterterrorism the deputy director the deputy director for operations deputy director for military affairs deputy director for analysis and then like the chief of hezbollah the chief of alex station whatever all the way around we were all in the bullpen there were so many of us that they had to set up they they named the aisles like it was bin laden boulevard hezbollah highway way. So you could say, oh, I work at the intersection of, you know, whatever. So there was a guy that had one of the private offices very near me, really friendly guy. And every morning he'd come in and say, good morning, guys. And we'd say, good morning, Rick. How you doing? Morning, guys. How was your weekend, guys? Hey, weekend was great, Rick. How are you. And, you know, after weeks of this, I said to this guy sat next to Frank, I said, you know, he's the nicest guy, but I don't have any idea what he does here. And Frank said, John, he's the head of the special activities division. And I was like, right, which explains why he disappears for a week at a time. As it turned out, he would get his orders from the participants in the so-called Tuesday morning kill list meeting, get his list of people that he needed to kill that week. The teams would fan out around the world, kill everybody on the list, and then come back the next Tuesday for the next week's list. And I remember saying, listen, I was traumatized as much as everybody else was on 9-11. But we're a nation of laws. And none of these people have ever been charged with a crime. If you're going to kill somebody, charge them with a crime, find them guilty, and sentence them. You can't just decide you don't like somebody's politics and you send a team out to whatever country he happens to be in and put a bullet in his head. Which we do. Which we do. Every day.

Yeah. Yep.

And so that was my first inkling that things had changed and they had changed quite dramatically. I knew, of course, about the torture program, the secret prison program, renditions. I mean, we wore renditions on our sleeves. There were no secrets surrounding renditions inside the building. It was only later that it came out into the public.

That's crazy. All right, let's get into some stories from the CIA. You can pick whatever you want to tell us, like maybe something funny. I have one story that John Nixon, our friend, mutual friend, told me. And that was like, to me, that was, wow, the sociopathic level in this agency is crazy. So it's about our favorite guy, John, Mike Hayden. I know, the war criminal, the crazy. I don't know which one is worse, Gina Hezbollah or Michael Hayden. I mean, he destroyed this country.

Hayden was more odious.

Right, exactly. And somehow he thought he was like the best person and smartest person in the room. so john nixon told me once and this is so funny you might know this story so the first time he saw hayden he saw him with this guy like younger guy just following him everywhere

And he was like, who the heck is this guy? I mean, we understand who Michael Hayden is. By the way, for people who do not know, Michael Hayden headed the CIA and NSA, both organizations, which is just crazy to me.

Head of NSA on 9-11.

Right, on 9-11. And also is the guy who pretty much aided Bush into Patriot Act, right? He was the one pushing it. He was the one helping create it. so he sold out his country in the shortest like you know version that i can give you but john nixon also a cio officer sees michael hayden and he's like moving around with this young man and this young man has a cooler like you know the soda cooler oh no yeah and he's just there moving around john was like who is this man like who is this young guy and they told him oh that's his personal assistant so that when he gets hot the cooler is right there he can provide sodas to him oh my god it's a real story it's a real story and um joe nixon goes like should we get a personal air conditioning for this guy or something like what's going on here and this is the head of nsa and the cia like walking around in in very sensitive meetings with this young man with the freaking cooler. What are we even discussing here, right? Let me add something about Mike

Pompeo. Okay. So I have a friend who was at the State Department. Yeah. And he resigned from the State Department to try to sort of go it alone, make a consulting firm, had some moderate success. I did a little bit of like lectures. I did some lectures for him. And then he said, I can't make a living doing this. So he applied to the CIA, got into the CIA in the office of security, doing close in protection of Mike Pompeo. And, you know, close in protection with like the folding machine gun strapped to his chest, that kind of thing, traveling all around the world with him. And we had lunch and I said, I said, so how's life with Mike Pompeo? And he said, oh my God, do you have any idea who is the only person less popular at the cia than mike pompeo i said no who he says mrs mike pompeo oh my goodness and i said really and he says he said here's my imitation of mrs mike pompeo you go get my dry cleaning you walk my dog the dog needs to go out and they're like mrs pompeo with all due respect we're not walking your dog and we're not picking up your dry cleaning we're here to protect your husband from getting shot wow wow that she was a monster

reminds me of hillary clinton oh she was another one oh tell us hillary clinton story you have a lot of those i remember stories very i forget his last name he wrote a book about them he was a secret service agent with the clintons and he said to me once that hillary clinton slept somebody like one of the secret service agents she literally slapped them in the face and if i had been that guy i would have slept back like and she wouldn't have gotten up from that like yeah who do you think you are you rotten human who do you think you are you know tell me like i saw i saw senator

maria cantwell one time throw a stapler at a staff aide and call him a fucking idiot you fucking idiot and she threw a stapler and then looked around to see if there were any cameras people

in charge of this country just like a freaking circus okay tell me a hillary clinton story we

gotta we gotta have one in every show oh my god well i've got kind of my now famous hillary Clinton story. I will say I was on a plane once. I was going to New York with my wife and my then wife and two sons. We were going to my brother's wedding in New York and Hillary Clinton was on the plane and she was in the first row. And a kid walked up to her and asked her for an autograph. And we heard her say like loudly enough that the first five or six rows could hear it. Get lost, kid so when I was stationed in Athens forgive me if you've heard this story already but when I was stationed in Athens we had a presidential visit and um when there's a presidential visit

laughing at the first I get lost kid she's got such a motherly instinct oh my god

My grandfather, I had an aunt who was kind of butch and my grandfather used to call her which means like a big burly bear and that's that was always the the greek nickname that I associated with Hillary Clinton. She's just a big, mean, burly bear. So when there's a presidential visit in the country that you're assigned to, everybody drops everything that they're doing to pitch in. It doesn't matter if you are CIA or state or commerce or agriculture or whatever you do, you're going to help with the presidential visit. So to be fair, the ambassador, whom I loathed, Nicholas Burns. Burns put all the jobs in a hat, like in an actual hat that he brought in. And we took turns picking our jobs out of the hat. Surprisingly democratic for somebody like Nick Burns. It was my lucky day I hit the lottery because the job that I pulled out was to be the note taker in Clinton's meeting with the prime minister. That was the job that everybody wanted. Right. So I mean, I was an accomplished note taker. People loved it when I would take notes. One of my station chiefs once told me that he so loved my reporting cables because when he would read them, he felt like he was in the room watching the meeting go down. And that was such a great compliment to me. So the meeting is held in the presidential suite at the Intercontinental Hotel. And it was the prime minister, the defense minister, the foreign minister. And for us, it was the president, secretary of state Albright, national security advisor Berger, Ambassador Burns, and me, and the Greeks had a note taker. yes so we had the meeting i've told that story before when the meeting was over the president and burger walked out together then albright and burns walked out together and then i walked out and i'm just standing there against the wall because my job is to be is to speak when spoken to my job's not to stand there and you know joke and josh with the president united states so i'm just standing there clinton burger finished their conversation so burger goes over to albright and burns and just as he does that i'm i'm two and a half feet from clinton at the end of the hall the elevator opens and hillary and chelsea walk off the elevator and she's got this look on her face i'm not exaggerating like this typical hillary look yeah and i looked at her and he

looked at her and i was like oh shit so she walks right up to us and she just stops there and one thing about bill clinton he hates silence he always wants to be laughing and talking and joking and telling stories so he says boy we sure had a good time at the parthenon this morning didn't we hill and she looks at him and she doesn't say anything so he repeats himself and he says we sure had a good time at the parthenon this morning didn't we hill and she says jesus christ bill it rained all day i'll be in the room and then she goes between us with chelsea and i look at clinton and he looks at me i didn't say anything but i he knew my look was like, you poor man, you have to lay next to that every day, every night. So he looks at me and he says, let's get the hell out of here. And he walks to the elevator. I follow him to the elevator. The Secret Service jumps in, then Berger and Albright jump in and the ambassador goes down to the basement to 500 screaming women from the Greek American Business Women's Association. And he gave one of these vintage Bill Clinton speeches. It was the very first time that I had seen with my own eyes, the Clinton aura, you know, there's some politicians that have it. Most don't. But I saw that Clinton aura for the first time.

It's a brand. They are not in love. I mean, you know, I feel like Bill is afraid of Hillary till today probably i agree with that yeah and she's like she's got the pants like she she wears him like yes like a puppet for sure it's great i'm glad that we didn't end up with uh as bad as things are joan i'm glad we didn't end up with her in power i think if hillary if hillary had won

in 2016 we would have been mired in eight years of unending war right i really believe it i agree with you i absolutely may i may i tell you another clinton story yeah so i became friendly with a guy who is now the president of um what is the president of rutgers university Clay Constantinou. Clay was the head of fundraising for Clinton in both 92 and 96, the head of fundraising for the Mid-Atlantic. There were six fundraising chiefs. He was the head of fundraising for the Mid-Atlantic. And he was named ambassador to Luxembourg as a reward. So he and I became friendly and he told me the greatest story about Monica Lewinsky. he's well not about Lewinsky about the Lewinsky scandal yeah and he said that um he said that all the six fundraisers got together when the Lewinsky scandal broke and they said Clinton's got to resign right we've got to go to him as a block as a group no daylight between us he's got to resign let's go talk to Gore so they talked to Al Gore they said we're going to call the president to resign and you would become president and it would set you up better to run in 2000 gore says okay i'm in they reserve a conference room at the willard hotel which is a block from the uh from the white house and they're like okay they meet the night before this is what we're going to do this is what we're going to say he's got to resign for the good of the country this Lewinsky scandal it's too much for Americans to take and um he's got to go and Gore's all in so they go to the Willard Clinton comes in and he looks at them and he says I have let you down friends and he starts crying chameleon chameleon clay said that somebody behind him behind him shouts we love you bill and he says i love you and then everybody's hugging and then they're shouting four more years four more years and i said come on clay he said listen somebody ratted us out he knew exactly what he was walking into that day wow he knew exactly what our weak point was and so gore never became president clinton never resigned the rest is history that is crazy and

you're so spot on gary said the same thing he told me bill clinton had this weird ability to convince you into whatever he wanted like if this guy and i'm quoting him now if this guy told me my name was not Gary, I would actually get my ID and look at it. That's the right thing it was. Yeah, it's crazy. Well, I'm glad we are over Clinton phase. But now, John, we have a whole new narcissist in the office. And I stand by this because as much as I loved Trump, as much as I supported him. He has shown that narcissism is real in the White House. And, you know, he isolated himself with ass kissers. I mean, Lindsey Graham and, you know, the Mark Levine and this crazy psychopath that are all for war. So let's talk about the situation with Israel and how we have the most pro-Zionist president ever. And why is that the case? How is that Israelis can lobby this entire freaking country beyond limitations. How is it? Oh, Lizzie, there is so much to talk about here. Start wherever you want, John. You know, let's start with AIPAC. Yes. AIPAC was

not a factor in American elections until the early 1970s. You know, it was a lobbying group. It never registered as a foreign agent. They felt that they never had to. And then certainly, you know, that power feeds on itself. But when Richard Nixon in 1969 guaranteed the security of Israel, that changed American politics. um it it emboldened the israelis johnson was strongly pro-israel kennedy was not and you know we can certainly have that conversation yes but but nixon made it actual u.s policy to guarantee the security of israel and and apac just kind of exploded in size and in funding to the point where they literally assign a lobbyist to every member of Congress, every single one. Some of them have multiple members of Congress. Lizzie, you've been up on Capitol Hill. You go to John Fetterman's office or you go to, what's his name, from Arkansas, the chairman of the Intelligence Committee. That idiot. I forget the name. That idiot. What's his name?

Guys, remind us in the chat. Come on. Help us out, guys. Help us out.

They have the Israeli flag outside their office. There's an American flag and an Israeli flag.

Oh, it almost came back to me. Tom Cotton. Yes. Or you can go with, again, Lindsey Graham, who told Americans that, I'm sorry, you're not as important as you. He said, forget it. I'm quoting him. Forget it. I stand with Israel. I don't stand with you. I stand with Israel.

Until his final breath, he said. Until my final breath, I will stand with Israel.

Randy Fine. I mean, I can. Randy Fine is another one. Yes. That's right.

And Randy Fine, didn't he wear an IDF uniform onto the floor of the house?

He also has an Israeli flag. We have a picture of him with the Israeli flag closer than the American flag, too. So it's absolute nonsense. Why do you think? Yeah, that's the case.

This now extends to state and local governments, too. I'll tell you a story I haven't told. A Texas state senator called me, and he's a fan, very nice guy. And he said, hey, I want to do a John Kiriakou Day in the state of Texas. It's a proclamation. We do like 140, 150 of these a year, and the governor signs it, and you get a certificate with a big seal of the state of Texas on it. I said, Oh my God, that's awesome. Thank you so much. He calls me three weeks later. He said, listen, that John Kiriakou day, that's not going to happen. And I said, what happened? And he said, he said, APAC objected. Wow. And I said, APAC is at the state legislature level. And he said, Oh yeah. In all 50 States. Well, now we know that they are lobbying individual school board race election school board races that's how deep they are in government and then when you couple that with somebody like mariam adelson oh my god others that spend hundreds

literally hundreds of millions of dollars on he's her money comes from right you know oh yeah oh yeah how tight she is with china do you remember because yeah the macao deal they

They made billions of dollars in Macau because the Chinese are degenerate gamblers.

Yes, yes. That's what made Edelson's the formidable power. I just did a post on X, which you guys should read. So she's so tightly intertwined with Chinese elites in government. Yes. And I'm quoting Trump now. He said, well, she's more supportive to Israel. She's more loyal to Israel. So you have a woman funding our president who's more loyal to Israel and is tied head and toe with China. where do you think things are going to go from from now on exactly exactly yeah so but here's the thing many people lobby the united states it's not just israel it's just israeli lobby is the most powerful and seems like they've got us somehow either with blackmail or whatever right so here's what i want to talk about why is that so dangerous and why is israel such a dangerous state and you had firsthand experience with so-called ally of the United States, how they spied on the CIA, how they hid information. Give me some stories about that because I want to show people what Israeli space really looks like. You know, I think they've seen it already, but let's

go, you know. I'll tell you a story that I've never told before. You've heard the story about how the Mossad would break into my colleague's house and cut the dog's tail off and take shits in all the toilets and rearrange the furniture. I've told that story a number of times. But another story was back in the 90s, the U.S. ambassador to Israel was driving from the embassy back to his residence and had a blowout. One of his tires had blown out. And so the driver pulls the car over and gets out. And two guys pull up and say, hey, you need some help changing the tire. So they help him change the tire. The ambassador had gotten out to take a look at it. He got back in the car. These guys drive away. The ambassador and his driver drive away. And they realized the ambassador's briefcase is missing. So it was a setup. It turned out that the tire had been shot. It hadn't blown out. It was a very well-placed, small caliber shot. So it flattened the tire. And while they momentarily distracted the driver and the ambassador, they stole his briefcase. Now, it had in it well maybe i shouldn't say what it had in it it had classified documents as you might imagine it would have now were those documents necessarily that important to the national security no but that's not the issue the issue is that they do things like this right we're supposed to be not just allies but the closest allies in the world exactly to their lives still do things

like this john answer this question if spain or england or any other country had done this what would happen to them they would be recommended pretty bad it would it would change

our relationship with that country for a generation right but israelis get a green

light on everything and they can excuse my language they languages they can shit all over And they know it will be just fine. Right. Yes. Do you think? Absolutely. Do you think that's because of the elite class, the Zionist elite rich class in the United States? Because Israel is this tiny little pipsqueak that we can crush any time. We don't even have to take military action. We can just seize the aid and that's it. Right. We can isolate them and that's it. So obviously the real power is here in the United States and this elite class that is supplying, I call it a triangle. So the elites put money, huge money into Israel, support it, bribe the politicians, and then Israelis come back and lobby us again. like it's almost like this money goes from the elites to the congress to israelis back to the the corporate world right do you think that's like a fair explanation of what's going on

i do i do think that's a fair explanation of what's going on but i'll tell you what the israelis are going to lead to their own demise oh yeah because i was thinking about this the other day and forgive the simplicity of this but you know how if you have a let's say you have a beaker of warm water, and you put salt in, the salt disappears in the water. The water just sort of absorbs the salt. But if you put in too much salt, it can't absorb anymore, and the salt just settles at the bottom. This is what the Israelis have done. The Israelis have pushed us to the brink. They accuse everybody who doesn't support Israeli government policy of being anti-Semitic. we're not anti-Semitic. We don't like Benjamin Netanyahu. And we don't like our government being told what to do by a foreign government. But you get to the point where you, you accuse everybody of being anti-Semitic and the word loses all meaning. It doesn't mean anything. Exactly. And so they're losing the American people. And then you end up with Lindsey Graham looking like a raving idiot when he gives a lunatic and tom cotton and john fetterman last week saying that he has a he has a friend it's an apac lobbyist who literally participates in every foreign policy discussion in that office and is on every phone call that fetterman does having to do with international affairs he's not a government employee he's an apac employee this

mental retard excuse my language what else can you call this like and he's proud of it they are proud of it and okay well i mean to your own destruction man the look at what's happening in the united states people never had hatred they were unfairly treated they they understood okay I guess that's the deal. But now there's a real hatred towards Israelis. And it was only born out of this madness. Right. So quickly, guys, I see your questions. So super chat. I see the super chat. I'll get to it in a bit. So first, I want to ask John a hard question. And I don't care, John, you know me, like I'm not afraid of anybody. I don't care. I'm just gonna say exactly what I believe. I never sugarcoat things. People are like, well, I don't oppose Israeli creation. I mean, you know, I'm pro-Israel, but I don't want to support Israel. And then to that, I always answer, I don't know. I kind of oppose Israeli creation. I mean, it's already there, so I cannot dismantle it. That would be illegal and criminal. But I'm not pro-Israeli creation as a state. I think it's a fake state. I think if I had been, you know, participant in the process, I would say no, I would veto it if I could have that power. So what is your opinion? Should Israel had been like, you know, created as an entity as it is today? Or do you think it's absolute nonsense?

that is it that is a tough one um you know i hate to even say this and people are going to lose their shit on me i really don't care i don't care one or the other um listen should there be an israeli state yeah maybe um it it frankly should

have been the reason you see that's what i don't understand well the the reason that i would say

is because of the politics of the time, the politics of 1947, 48, 49. The war has just ended. The Holocaust has just taken place. The Jews wanted a homeland, needed a homeland. The international community agreed. They went about it in all the wrong way.

Yeah, but did they though? This is the question no one can answer. And I think you're smart enough, bright enough and direct enough to do that for me. so i don't think jews needed a state i think politics needed you know their own outlet in the middle east and that's why it happened because here's the thing that's entirely possible yeah i mean jews were oppressed okay where exactly other than germany and italy because poland yeah poland okay so georgians treated jews really well um well depends in ukraine and they had a safe haven in the united states as well so henry kissinger was a wartime jew escaped germany and became one of the most important figures in america so i'm sorry but i don't buy this story that jews were oppressed in america richie boy camp yeah i don't think they were oppressed in america richie richie boys the camp the famous camp richie boys were german jews it was like kind of german jew immigrants that reached you know high levels of government positions and many more so i don't think they needed a state because they were oppressed i don't think we should go ahead and you know start assigning religious uh you know a group of people states and just giving them a land but i think it happened because the united states zionist organization needed an outlet in the middle east it was too important to lose it and so it was established do you would you agree with that and obviously there are many other

reasons but would you agree oh yeah but but i think though i mean in terms of rail politique it's done and there's nothing we can do about it now i think what we really need to focus on as a country as a part of the international community is there absolutely must be a free and independent palestine totally it's not negotiable there has to be an independent palestine i i went to israel twice in 2022 first time i had ever been i i boycotted it all the years that I was at the agency. I focused only on the Arab countries. That's my passion, my love. So I never went until 2002. I'm sorry, 2022. And one of the things that struck me was that literally every Israeli that I spoke to mocked me when I said something about the two-state solution. And then I said something that really pissed them off. I said, frankly, I support a three-state solution. They were like, what are you talking about? I said, there's no possible way that the West Bank and the Gaza Strip can be a non-contiguous, successful country. It's not possible. Gaza should be its own country. Or it could even be a protectorate of Saudi Arabia or Egypt or something like that. But the West Bank, at least, has to be Palestine with Jerusalem as

its capital. Not negotiable. I agree with that. I think that's a great solution. I think it's

incredible. So why not? Why not? Why not? Why not? Well, the Israelis, and see, this is another thing. Somebody said in the chat a second ago, it made me think of it. Why are we not allowed to say the word Jew anymore? I talked about Christians, Muslims, and Jews recently in a podcast. And somebody corrected me in the chat and say christians muslims and people of the jewish faith

oh um oh i see i see okay how do you like that and i'm like no i'm not doing that jews

christians muslims and jews yeah i don't understand it um you know another thing that bothered me very much you see this odd propaganda when you're in israel i wanted to go to the western wall right I'd never been it's in the heart of Jerusalem the heart of the old city so I go there and people have put up signs all over the place that say America we are with you it's like what the fuck are you talking about I'm sorry that makes me laugh with us where on what we don't want to with us yeah and then you see these you see these billboards all over that have that have trump and netanyahu side by side and they're they're looking you know like il duche right in those old photos from the 30s and 40s it's like what is this weird propaganda all over the country. It's like the propaganda is not even meant for Israelis. It's meant for Americans who are visiting Israel.

A hundred percent. No one cares, John, about Israel. Look at the protests. Do you think they call it, oh, we have a democracy? No, you don't have shit. So, yeah.

Well, like Tucker said the other day, Lizzie.

Yeah.

What kind of democracy is it when millions upon millions of your citizens aren't permitted to vote? That's not a democracy.

No. Not at all. So I absolutely agree with you on that and on the Israeli part of things. So now, as we almost are at the end of this, and I have to get to the super chat questions, which I'll put it on the screen so you can read it as well, John.

Okay, thank you.

So quickly, what is the solution to get rid of this cancer here? Do you think that cutting the lobbying is one of the solutions? Obviously, it never will happen. They outstead Thomas Bessie. Every time someone comes in with fresh ideas, it's like, let's organize, gang. Let's kill them. Let's kick them out. Well, they can literally kill them, but they politically kill them as much as they can. So give me like at least one solution. What can be done to get rid of this cancer in this country?

The very first thing, the very, very first thing is that AIPAC must be forced to register as a foreign agent. It is a foreign agent. It is. Lizzie, I'll give you a kind of a silly example. Yeah. Back in 2008, I was working for myself and I won a very modest contract to write, I think it was four op-eds for the Abu Dhabi Chamber of Commerce. I had to register as a foreign agent. I mean, this was like a $5,000 contract, and I had to register as an agent of the Abu Dhabi government. But AIPAC spends literally hundreds of millions of dollars on American political races at every single level. And they're just a group of concerned Americans who happen to be pro-Israel, and that is just nonsensical. So number one, they have to register. Number two, as recently as the George W. Bush administration, there was a real debate taking place in the American Muslim community about whether or not it was Islamic to participate in elections. there was a real fight and the answer should be a resounding absolutely yes muslims should be voting they should be marching and protesting and running for office just like everybody else does

yeah as american citizens right like yeah well yeah here's the thing this country says there there is a religious freedom here you want to be a jew be a jew you want to convert to judaism be my guest you want to be a muslim be a muslim as long as you're a legit american citizen you hold oh one more very important effing thing you hold one passport i'm for that like i like if you want to you know be loyal to other countries then you have to come out and declare yourself that i can never get into politics because i have like three passports and you know i'm loyal to three countries i think that should be made a rule but for usual americans you can hold whatever you want but for politics and Congress, like, no, bro, like now you have bigger responsibility. So American passport is the only way here, right? But I agree with you with the elections and everything else. So let me get to the questions real quick, because people have been waiting. We've got some new members as well. So let me know if you can see the questions, John.

Hi, Jason.

Hi. So this one was a good one. John, do you believe that the CIM culture program is still going on? Also, I'm praying for your pardon. Oh, yes. And thank you for speaking out.

Thank you for that. You know, I'm getting a little bit of feedback, Lizzie. I don't know why.

Sorry, one second. Let me, you know what? I'm going to mute myself so you can answer the question. i don't know what's going on but yeah go ahead so god i hate to even say it but

yeah i do believe that there is some kind of mk ultra like program taking place i i think that if the cia stopped mk ultra that stop was uh was temporary they don't

call it MKUltra, certainly. They're not experimenting with LSD. You know, that's all been done. I doubt that there's, you know, anything around the issue of remote viewing or stuff that was experimented with in the 50s, in the 60s, into the early, mid 70s. I think now it's all tech. And I think it's exceedingly dangerous. If you haven't done so, go to Wikipedia and look up Vault 7. it's going to make your hair stand up. But there was a CIA whistleblower by the name of Joshua Schulte who leaked the so-called Vault 7 documents to WikiLeaks. They are far more damning than anything that Ed Snowden ever revealed. And it shows you just how deep the CIA is technologically in our day-to-day lives. Absolutely. And since we're on it, John, they had even years ago,

40 plus years ago during castro they had cancer by a weapon and all they had to do just sprinkle something or a pinprick and i believe it was hugo chavez that told either vladimir putin or someone else i can't he told castro okay so that's right that um like they can just like it would be like a pinprick like a little thing that they can um sting you with and you can develop like a serious cancer so it was it was a thing and they have bio weapons like you know some kind of viruses

and we we've all seen that well they experimented with viruses yes and with uh bacteria um as part of mk ultra they released them into the atmosphere in san francisco right uh and and then they experimented in that french village with with the bakery bread since free was the village and

Yeah. And Frank Olson felt so guilty. He was a CIA operative and he felt so guilty that he started talking about and they dosed him and threw him off the window.

Yeah. Committed suicide.

Yeah, exactly. So what scares you the most from these weapons? That's actually very, that's the question I want you to answer because you've been in the industry, you've been inside the CIA. What scares you from these weapons more than anything?

You know, to tell you the truth, biological weapons were never, they were never able to develop biological weapons to the point where they could use them on a massive scale. I'm far more afraid of technological weapons. Far more afraid.

Not counting COVID, now that we know that CIA whistleblowers said that. Right. In a way, a biological weapon, right? COVID was, in a way.

In a way, yeah. And I think now it's generally accepted that it was a lab leak, despite the denials after denials. It was a lab leak. I will say, in 2002, when I was the executive assistant to the deputy director for operations, that's when SARS broke out in Southeast Asia. And the deputy director ordered me to write a cable, an all-hands cable for every CIA officer in the world, saying, no travel anywhere for anyone. It was the first time in my career we ever had a travel ban. And it was because of SARS. And I said, are you really that afraid that this is going to turn into something? And he said, yes. He said, my biggest fear is a pandemic. And I kind of kept that in the back of my head until, you know, 2019 when COVID broke out. And I was like, well, here it is. This is exactly what he was afraid was going to happen. And it happened. And it turned

out it happened because of a lab leak absolutely next one is there ordinance in so-called outlawing

gardens i don't know do you know this this is for you not that not that i ever heard of i always it was always my belief that that was voluntary yeah let me see next one

okay so this is probably for john did you ever support trump looking back was it during this swamp ever draining this swamp ever real or doomed once it uh conflicted with apac other foreign interests thanks so i guess this person is a question yeah if if it was a ever real or

maybe he played the game no i don't i don't think he played the game i think that there were two problems i think one problem was that he underestimated the power of the swamp he underestimated the power of the deep state and number two when he had genuine opportunities to really do something to dismantle it he instead

gave appointments to deep state figures for example um john bolton mike pompeo gina haspel

what the heck was everyone warned him about all these people i had ram paul in my show and ram paul said i warned the president who john bolton was like all these people psychopathic maniacs He still gave them this stage and position. Why do you think that happened?

Why? I think that he seriously underestimated the reach of the deep state. So here he gets elected president in 2016. He becomes president in 2017. He names these people around him that he thinks are outsiders. And they actually weren't outsiders. a lot of them were they appeared as outsiders but they were long-time insiders and they were connected to insiders yeah and so when you're drawing from the heritage foundation the heritage foundation is the quintessential insider conservative involved in everything

freaking everything even the data centers even the data centers i mean can we just like what what is this? You know, like a Nazi Germany top down rule. Exactly. Exactly. And it wasn't just

the Heritage Foundation. It was the American Enterprise Institute. Yeah. Yeah. You know, and a lot of this APAC money. I mean, these these are quintessential insiders. They don't want outsiders. Outsiders are unpredictable. And so I think they were able to infiltrate the first Trump administration quite quickly and easily. And, and then the rest is a very disappointing

history. Absolutely. Okay, next one. Don't you think the country is held hostage by the Fed being Israeli owned? No, sorry. Yeah, I think the country's held hostage by the elites and bankers and financiers and that's different yeah yes it's not israeli that owns the fed it's just elites created israel i always say this for a reason and now they're looking for looking out for their baby that's what's going on okay next one do you think candace owens and tucker carlson genuinely worry about israel's influence or use it as a scapegoat to leave maga i'm debating a

from ah well i i've never met candace tucker is a friend of mine i'm proud to say and i can tell you that tucker genuinely believes everything he says he genuinely believes every argument he makes and i think he's truly worried about it candace i'm not sure what i met candace i can speak for

that obviously what I saw right I love Candace Owens I think she's exactly what what she's on you know on her show as like in real life she was exactly that person she's very genuine I think she's very upset what happened to Charlie Kirk I mean Charlie and Candace were inseparable they were good friends and all of a sudden Charlie dies and the answer is like some scrawny weird kid that they can't talk or can't fire a gun killed him yeah i would be upset too so no i think both of them are very real in this like there is a serious coordinated propaganda that john was a victim to and i was a victim to against them and every time someone touches uh tucker carlson or candace owens or we invite them in the show or something boom the trolls on x just explode like that's a coordinated campaign okay so they oh my god yes yes lizzie you cannot believe

the death threats i've been getting oh they would make your hair stand up and i'll tell you what um i have to interrupt myself kyle kostek sorry but you're a fucking idiot yes the death threats that i'm getting where these people have become so bold yeah that they put

their name their phone number and their email address yeah yeah trust me i know after candace's interview john i've never seen anything like this from my emails to x and especially x because it's completely a zionist platform today they pay too much money because they know that that's the only platform they can actually influence because you can't delete the comments so right now people say it right zelinski said this i don't know if you watch tucker carlson's and zelinski's um yeah the idea was if just enough people say shit people will it so keep saying it keep saying keep lying we want garbles propaganda guys keep lying so anyway yeah let's get to the next one national center center for medical intelligence i'm not sure

what you guys that that's an interesting idea that's an interesting oh okay but but how would you how would you ensure independence right it would just be another arm of the deep state

right very true very true so i think guys uh we are done with the uh super chat if you want to send it send it in like next five minutes because i'm gonna ask john for one last story and um yeah because i know what story i want people are laughing so guys we are we have very smart intelligent men and women at the cia doing incredible work they have a sexual problem though i want the gunneria story oh shit

where do you even begin you know we we had this joke at the cia that when you go into a conference room don't ever touch the table because you don't know who was having sex on it last night and it's true the the deputy director that i worked for uh-huh was married five times and every one of his five wives had started off as his secretary So it got so bad that in 2004, the CIA had to send doctors from the Office of Medical Services, OMS, out to Iraq because CIA officers were passing around a cia specific strain of gonorrhea it had morphed into its own its own entity where only cia people had this particular strain of gonorrhea and they were like people you gotta control yourselves and wear protection for god's sake

how embarrassing imagine identifying a cia officer because they went to bed

it's just unreal all right so last one here um and ah okay jason i did not know that i did not know that and i i have to tell you i am not comfortable with it at all at all not at all national center for medical intelligence is a branch of the defense intelligence agency yeah well i think we are well one more sorry wait wait wait wait what's my favorite my favorite

angry bird oh i i didn't see it sorry which one was the angry bird is it like a super chat

do you know it's a dollar ninety nine from triumphant thank you for that what's my favorite angry bird oh okay i you know it used to be the black one because he explodes i love him but now there are a couple of others there's one that sucks everything and then you can spit it all back out and then the new white one that spins around and knocks everything down i love that one too although he's weaker than uh than my other ones because i need some time to build up his strength i have to i i bought him 35 000 feathers today john i mean not with money i i used I used my coins to buy to buy 35,000 feathers

it's gotta love Angry Birds it's fascinating that you know this shit I've never played Angry Birds is that a game I don't know

I'm addicted Lizzie Lizzie I have played Angry Birds literally every day without missing a single day for 8 years

and 10 months oh my god I gotta try

it's my only vice I don't drink I don't smoke I don't do drugs

something i gotta do something i i need any advice i'm pretty sure like i'm the same way i don't drink i don't do drugs i don't party i need advice guys maybe give me an advice what to do all right next

one real quick uh i'm in i am in yes set it up i'll be there you know my arabic teacher once asked me if i would get into the ring with mike tyson this is when mike tyson was at his peak would i get in the ring with mike tyson for a million dollars i said akid of course i would i said i would get in the ring with mike tyson for one thousand dollars he's like one thousand dollars are you nuts i said no he's gonna hit me one time he's gonna knock me out

get a thousand dollars you get a thousand dollars and you got kicked or hit by mike tyson right exactly there you go it's a great story so you and john brennan have a have a beef right yeah we hate each other we've always hated who doesn't hate john brennan i'm sure you know do you know that story when a teenager like um i think he hacked john brennan's yeah yes a british kid john brennan's freaking phone yes scared the shit out of him you know that story right do you at

first he blamed the north koreans it's like no it's some 14 year old from england i'm glad he

didn't blame russians like it's always the freaking russians you know somebody i think uh we need to clean up something here john before we wrap this up somebody and i hear this all the freaking time because of bustamante bustamante what he deserved from me uh you know the shit head officer like whatever paper boy i call him so um people are saying why do you work for russian channel blah blah blah explain to them what they did to your career and you and to your family and the only people who actually gave you something was this channel right so explain to them before

we wrap up and then we're done yeah uh when i got out of prison um as as a term of my release i had to get a job. It's impossible to get a job, not just with a felony, but with a national security felony. And so I got turned down at Safeway. I got turned down by Uber, by Target and Walmart and McDonald's. I worked for one day as a baggage handler at the Reagan National Airport. And then And they fired me after one day because they realized I had a national security felony. The Russians offered me a radio show. I turned it down. Six months later, they offered me the radio show again. And I said, the only way I would take this is if I could say anything I want about anybody I want, including Vladimir Putin. They said, done. I said, would you put that in writing in the contract? They said, yes. And they did. and it on the day of the russian invasion i opened my show with i unreservedly condemned the russian invasion of ukraine and i urged russian troops to withdraw immediately even i

did not condemn it because you know i'm the free one that's not even paid by anybody other than you know so yeah so kudos to you and i'm glad you explained that but the thing is is i could not i

have five kids and I still had three kids to put through school I had to work very vicious ex-wife

who would not chill out uh with court so yeah and I gotta say something I don't know if you remember this John but for people to know what kind of person you are so when I met John John didn't have anything like platform or anything he was right out of like prison and yes this was the toughest most poor period right that's that's when we met yeah that's when we met and despite that guys John stayed a gentleman and I don't remember uh John asking me you know what why don't you take a ride and come see me you're like no I'll pick you up I remember you came with the Mercedes like was it Mercedes old yeah I have I drive a 16 year old Mercedes yeah so so he never lost uh this this instinct of gelatin and like i remember he took me out in virginia this is later on but still you you had nothing back then too like took me out to see like virginia when i was living in dc and like you know it's just yeah he's he's just a very good guy and thank you very much thank you last question john since they sent it and we're done does your arabic still sound good or yeah go ahead go on

after 30 years I've forgotten the whole language practically

oh no you speak perfect all right well tell people where to find you we already had a demo of your show well we talked about your show thank you yeah tell them where to find you

on YouTube it's at realjohnkiriaku and I'm on X I'm on Facebook I'm on Insta I'm on Twitter is X. What's the other one? LinkedIn.

You're on Instagram as well.

Yeah. Yeah. They're all there. So thank you for that. Thank you.

Absolutely. I will put down all these links below, guys, and I will call up John's YouTube afterwards when this goes up as a video and you can click on it and go and see his channel. So thank you so much, John. Thanks, everybody. Thanks, Lizzie.

Always great to see you.

Always great. Thank you.

Thanks.

Thank you.