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Dimitri was here when Donald Trump was here.

Wow, that made my day.

It was important. It doesn't matter what side. It doesn't? No. There we go. Wow, these are nice. Dimitri the Snake. Yeah, Tapeworm. There he is. Oh, that's right. Tapeworm, yeah.

what's going on with your face what are you doing ah this is a tight one for me today guy i'm feeling ripe what is that it's a it says betty billy billy oh b-i-l-l-y oh it's a uh Uh, it's a memorial tattoo. I don't know if you knew this or not, but, uh, my, uh, my kid got hit by a truck.

When did you have a kid?

About two years ago. I haven't told anyone. I was ashamed. It was a one night stand. kid

is it a human kid

yeah

Billy

he got hit by a truck got hit by a truck was he just walking well someone and I won't say who left the gate open and uh he wandered out into the street and uh boom like hit by a 18 wheeler and uh this is like a memorial so you got billy tattooed on your forehead i have two tattoos i got billy on my forehead and i got a tattoo of his little face over my heart let me see it really

yeah god first of all what happened to the one when you were attacked by the bear

That healed up. This is Billy.

Billy Goat.

He's a kid. Billy the Kid? Yeah.

Yeah.

Poor little guy.

Poor little guy.

He was a service animal.

I thought he was your son.

Well, he was my boy. He was a kid.

But you said he got him out of a one-night stand.

Well, the girl sold him to me. He was a service animal. Yeah. It sucks, dude. And you know what sucks? He was hit by a truck that was hauling medical supplies. Okay? How ironic. Right. He's laying there, and to watch your kid bleat to death, he's just laying on the pavement like, just bleeding to death. Amazing he was still alive. Well, I couldn't believe it. He was alive, and a respirator rolled out of the back of the truck, a life-saving device, and crushed his head.

So he was killed not by the truck, but by the final blow of the respirator landing on him? Right.

What are the odds? Well, this is the irony in life, Joe. Like, he got hit by the truck, might have survived, a respirator rolled out of the back. these things weigh a good half ton lands on the idiot on the kid's face and uh gone poor billy so memorial tattoos well you're a good guy i was a good i would have ate him is that right yeah how does goat taste i haven't had it it's pretty good yeah wait you have sure

first time i ever had it was in la at a mexican spot they still they were selling goat tacos they delicious oh my god yeah and then i had a neighbor well not a neighbor he's a landscaper that was a friend of mine that would uh he would fight chickens they do chicken fights cock fights yeah yeah i've had those trying to be polite cleaning up for the viewers well chicken chicken

fights cock is kind of the technical name seems wrong yeah when you're saying it have you ever

i don't like how you're saying it but anyway they would roast a goat he told me uh whenever they would do a cock fight yeah feel better well it's not for me it's for the culture yeah i mean it is what it is a pit bull fight actually i wonder how you say it in spanish because el coco so anyway he lived in this neighborhood you would swear to god that it was mexico it was crazy like every sign was in spanish all the people were in spanish there was roosters everywhere he just on his tree you hear like all day long it was like it was crazy and so he had this friend of Yeah, friend of his rather he went to we went

backyard and in the backyard there's just stacks and stacks of rooster cages they had so many roosters and they had these prize roosters and they had a whole pit so they had a thing it was almost like a barn looking area right and you go in there and there's a pit a cockpit and then that's where they would fight and he was showing me where they would roast a goat he said every time they would have a cock fight they'd roast a goat and everybody'd have beers and well if

you're gonna have a cock fight you might as well roast a goat that's what i said but if i had a cockpit in my backyard i'd get it like a delta pilot and an american airlines pilot and toss them in and let them fight it out let them fight it out in the cockpit who do you think would win probably delta because they have the dei program do they yeah or in this case they all do the dia the die program because someone ain't coming out alive well i think we need pilots so maybe you

should do it with someone that's like overrepresented in the marketplace like what what would be like we could get rid of some of those folks who we could single out yeah yeah it would be like we've had enough there's too many of you guys yeah politicians yeah yeah oh yeah homeless advocates

i'd love to see politicians get in a pit and fight right yeah two men enter one man leave

I mean, that had to be how it went down a long time ago.

Yeah. A long time ago. Oh, you're talking like cavemen years? Yeah, tribal days. Tribal days. Yeah, they probably had a fight.

Yeah, I think. My opponent's a piece of shit. He wants to steal all the coconuts.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I think back then the hierarchy worked based on physical dominance, intimidation. Mm-hmm. Like, you'd be a good leader. You got, you're jacked.

Yeah, I'm not a good leader, though, because I'd be like, you got to do what you want to do. I'm not really interested in running this place. I got to get out of here.

Yeah. Yeah. Because once you decide you're running it, you're stuck with everything.

Yeah. And all the problems are your problems. Wow. And everyone wants to kill you. Like, who the fuck would want to be president? This is why voting for president is a real problem. Yeah. Like, in 2028, everybody's like, who's going to win in 2028? Who's going to win? Who's going to run? Who wants that fucking job? What normal, healthy person wants that job where at least half the country is going to fucking hate you? And the people that you got in, that got you in, they're not going to be happy because you're never going to be able to do what you're saying you want to do. It's not even possible. What did you just put up, Jim?

I was going to say, do you think they could start dueling again like they did in the 1700s and 1800s? It's a duel. Yeah.

A duel, yeah. According to Perplexity, our AR sponsor, politicians fought literally with fists, canes, swords, and pistols, and some famous ones were killed or badly injured in these clashes. 1700s to 1800s, dueling was a common way for gentlemen and politicians to defend their honor in Europe and the United States. That would be sick. If congressmen, you know, they start screaming and yelling at each other like they always do. Yeah. I challenge you to a duel. everyone's like oh let's go out on the White House lawn Andrew Jackson killed Charles Dickinson yeah the author was wounded himself 50 that's not the author is no no no no no I mean that's Dickens that's a review for a book when

you go you piece of shit I didn't like Tom Sawyer boom the chickens right Tom

Sawyer? Or Huck Finn? No, no, no, that was King? Samuel Clemens. Mark Twain. Twain! What the hell did Dickens write? Oh, I don't remember.

The Christmas one. Christmas one?

The Grinch? Which one did he write?

Grinch that stole. Oliver Twist. Christmas Carol is the one I was trying to think of. David Copperfield. Great Expectations.

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Oh, he wrote that? Yeah, Christmas Carol is the one I was thinking of.

Okay. He wrote some great stuff. What year was, put that thing up again about the duels? because uh so jackson killed someone in 1806 when was he president later this is later wow yeah so he shot someone and then became president he was a murderer and

he became president president did it in 1804 whoa jd vance is going out and shooting the treasury

secretary right now well this is crazy they had a pistol duel with the treasurer secretary Hamilton was mortally wounded And died the next day

That would be crazy to see right now Wow It ended this guy Burr's

Political career Scroll back up again Aaron Burr So it was the Vice President Aaron Burr Shot the fucking Treasury Secretary That's crazy Former Treasury Secretary And killed him and then it ended his career Even in 1804 They were like that's outrageous But isn't that crazy? That was just the 1800s. Yeah. 200 years ago, they were shooting each other. And America's all about guns, so why aren't we just doing that now? It would end a lot of really shitty conversations. Yeah. Because a lot of people, they talk in a way, they say horrible, mean things because they know there's no repercussions. Yeah. If they could just challenge you to a fistfight on the Senate floor, if that was a thing, it would change a lot.

1856.

Representative Preston Brooks of South Carolina Ended the U.S. Senate chamber And brutally beat Senator Charles Summer of Massachusetts with a cane After Summer gave an anti-slavery speech That insulted Brooks' cousin Summer was left unconscious And badly injured Whoa Whoa, because he gave an anti-slavery speech Imagine, why'd you hit him? The guy's against slavery Oh Did you use a weapon at least? Yeah, he's a cane. He's against slavery. What the hell? What do you want to do? Just let him be against slavery? Yeah. He insulted my cousin, a slave owner. Wow. Well, you know, America's, like, kind of built on gun culture, so it sort of seems to fit, you know? Well, also, combat, like, thank you, it's just a little bit more. It's like violence. Yeah. This is going to be a UFC on the White House lawn. Yeah. That seems like a good, safe place to be, huh? Everyone's going to know where all the world leaders are going to be. We're all going to be stuck sitting in that spot for six hours calling fights. You're going to be there, right? Super safe. I feel completely safe. You're going to be there, right? Yeah. Oh, I'm going to be there. Do you like the concept of it or no? I do not like it. How come, guy? Because it's outside. And I think world championship fights should be in a controlled environment. Yeah. Out of respect for the athletes and how difficult it is to compete professionally in a world title. However, I should say, however, it's going to be a spectacle. Whether I was there or not, I would be watching 100%. I think it's awesome that Trump, this is one of the things that I like about him. He's like, fuck it, let's do it. He puts on cage fights on the White House lawn. That's nuts. He's fearless. He does wild shit. I like that. Yeah, me too. I like that part. I don't like the Iran war thing, but I like that.

You don't like the concept that Iran can no longer have nuclear weapons? I think that's better than a UFC fight. That is a good concept.

However, I don't necessarily know there's a clear way to get out of this. And if you know what we did in Afghanistan for 20 years and how much American taxpayer dollars we spent and how many people lost their lives.

But in Afghanistan, it felt like they were just sweeping out like goat farmers and guys hiding in caves. Whereas here, there's a directive where they're preventing a rebel country from having a bomb that could annihilate portions of our planet. That's true. So I think that's a much clearer and more positive agenda than wiping out guys living in the hills of Afghanistan, creating opium.

That's true, if it made sense. The problem is I had Scott Horton on the podcast explaining what is actually involved in making depleted uranium and making it weapons grade and what would have to be done in order to get it to a bomb level. It's very difficult. Right. It's not as simple. And they weren't nearly capable of doing that.

Not nearly, but pursuing.

It's a good question because he was also saying they were being inspected on a regular basis. And essentially this is Israel wanting us to go to this war Yeah And it makes sense If I was Israel If we were America and Mexico had nukes pointed at us Or whatever, it's not nukes But you know what I'm saying Like if they did, if they were trying to build a nuke If Mexico and America were constantly in conflict And Mexico was trying to build a nuclear bomb That would be a good reason Where America would want to go fuck up Mexico Like hey you can't have a nuclear bomb This is Israel's position right israel's right there with iran they're close enough they're throwing missiles at each other i get why they would want it i just don't know if it's a good thing for america and i don't know

if there's a way out of it well i think what we have to look at is the bigger scope if not america cleaning it up who does it who has the power and the wherewithal to do it you know we've used like

two-thirds of our missiles doing it yeah but we leaves us vulnerable if there's any other kind of a conflict we're like under armed right now i don't think we're ever under armed when we have

our triton submarine force lurking in the oceans 24 7 and nobody knows they're there even members of american military what do you know how do you know this oh i know things guy billy tell you this

billy billy's dead wait a minute do you know something about these triton submarines i sure What do you do? What do you know?

Well, they're circumnavigating our oceans 24-7. How many are there? I think there's a fleet of 12 to 24. I think it's closer to 12. But these things can stay underwater for up to a year. And most members of our American government don't even know they're there. They don't know where they are.

How much underwater jerking off is going on right now?

Well, think about it. One Triton submarine, Triton submarine. Has how many guys on it? I don't know how many guys, but it has something like 24 nuclear warheads. And how many guys jerking off? And each warhead has 24 that break off. So one of these submarines could take out half the world, and we've got them going all the time. So whenever you're afraid of any little hot spot in the world, just remember that we have this going on in the ocean. A lot of people don't know about it. I like you say there's we shit when you're Canadian. Yeah. Interesting.

Yeah. When the shit hits the fan, Canadians like to pretend they're Americans. I like it.

I'm just not worried. Like, I'm not worried about America ever being vulnerable. It's an area, it's a nautical force that you don't really hear about. But if you were to look it up, there's this force out there that could take out the world. Well, Jamie just looked it up. Jamie, look it up.

U.S. Navy submarine force today consists of about 53 of fast attack submarines, 14 ballistic missile submarines, and four guided missile submarines, all nuclear powered. That yields a total of roughly 70 to 71 nuclear submarines in the force, making it the world's largest nuclear submarine fleet. Why, currently in the oceans is classified, except for people who talk to Harlan. Exactly. Harlan knows. The exact number of U.S. nuclear submarines at sea at any moment and their locations are classified for operational security. The Navy does not release real-time deployment figures. Public discussion instead uses overall force and general deployment concepts like continuous SSB and deterrent patrols rather than day-by-day counts. Okay. That makes me feel a little better.

Well, you need not worry. And that's – you didn't even tap into the tridents. The tridents are the nuclear ones that run silent. You can't ping them. You're pro. You can't go, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop

pinging. That's sonar. What do you mean? You can't use sonar to find them? You can't ping them. They're nuclear. They're silent. They're silent predators in the ocean. Really? They're huge. And I told you, one nuclear warhead splits off into 16 or 24. So, one of these damn Trident submarines could put anyone in its place at any time. So, don't you worry about our missiles being depleted, Mr. Joe Zachary Rogan. Zachary How did I get a new nickname? I don't know If I know about submarines, I know about your middle name Okay, I'm going to have to change my license

In current open sources, Trident submarines usually means U.S. Navy, Ohio class ballistic missile submarines That carry Trident II, D-5 nuclear missiles And there are 14 of these boats There you go And so these boats are just floating around Ready to fuck people up So do you think it was a good idea to go into Iran? Start bombing?

I think whoever's the bad player, I think it's a good idea. If it was North Korea, Iran, Israel, Canada, Mexico, whoever's causing shit in the world, we don't have time for you. Let's get in line. Let's all work together or you get a timeout. We don't have time for this anymore. We're a society of sophisticated human beings. We got to move forward. There I am, sonar guy. Look at you, dude. That's me on a trident. That's what you do in your spare time? Yeah, I ride around the world protecting things. Do they dye your hair before you go into there? Sure got an old memory when he started doing that.

Right? What movie was that in?

Down Periscope.

Down Periscope.

Oh, look at you, dog. Yeah. But this is real, guys. So I'm just saying to you, don't ever fret. Okay. There's no one on Earth that can threaten America. How did 9-11 happen then? Well, that was land-based, that was terrestrial, and that was simple planning and box-cutting and hijacking. But we're talking about global warfare, nuclear war. Let's say Moscow launched and hit seven of our cities tomorrow. Well, guess what, Moscow? Debbie, seven or eight Chinese submarine waiting just offshore for you.

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It doesn't matter. America doesn't lose is what I'm trying to tell you, my guy.

Oh, we still win when everyone's dead?

Yeah, we still win. The guys floating around in the Indian Ocean and the Atlantic and the North Sea, they're still there.

So those sailors will be the new civilization. America wins even when they lose, my guy. Maybe that's why the aliens are under the water. Maybe they're the ones that survived the apocalypse.

You believe that? Yeah, I don't know about the aliens under the water.

Congressman Tim Burchett was on this podcast. Well, what does he know? And he said that there are three, did he say three bases or five? I don't remember.

When your last name's bullshit. No, no, no. What is it?

It's Burchett.

Oh, Burchett. I'm sorry.

He's a very honest man. So what did he say? He said that there's these three locations, I think it's three. Three or five, I can't remember which one he said.

Don't let me tell you.

Five. So you said there's these spots under the ocean where regularly they have these events where things come out of the ocean.

When you say things, are we talking giant squid? Are we talking extraterrestrial?

They're talking crafts that move in a way that we can't right now. 500 miles an hour under the water.

transmedium, meaning they can go above the ground and in the water with no, it doesn't seem like it's causing them any resistance. Bruchette said there are five underwater bases, and in some reports it's phrased as five or six. The clearest reporting says he pointed to five areas in the U.S. waters where such bases could be. There's a bunch of areas in the ocean, and if you think, like you were going to hide something, that's where you would hide it. We don't go in the ocean that much.

Well, we go in the ocean, but we don't know the ocean it hasn't been mapped i think we've only mapped less than 10 percent of

the ocean floor we know more about the surface of the moon than we knew know about the bottom of the correct and so when they're if they're if they were here that would be the place to hide just go to the deepest parts of the ocean where no one can go yeah and you build bases because if they can travel here from another planet yeah james cameron went to the bottom of the mariana trench We watched a video of it the other day. Fascinating. So he did that in 2012. If he can do that, for sure something that can come here from another planet can also go down there and most likely set up a base.

I'm skeptical. I'm not denying it. But I'm thinking if you're an extraterrestrial and you're coming to a planet like ours, What's the upside of going deep down into a trench that's, I think it's, what, three, four, five miles deep? The Areoli Trench? Areoli? What's it called? I don't think that's what it's called.

Huh? Areola's the thing around. Your tits. The tits.

Did you catch this yesterday? Probably, maybe not. The new Disclosure Day trailer. I did. So Steven Spielberg's in it. Yeah, he's saying.

First of all, bro, cut your nails. You're freaking me out. Oh, wow. He's a nose picker.

Some people keep them long to get boogers. Is that what he's doing for them? Spielberg probably likes to pull out a crank out a greenie. Boy. Yeah. Picture Spielberg laying in bed at night just cranking out a greenie and eating it.

So he said that he believes that we are being visited much. I don't think he does that. He's a respectable man. Look at those nails. Those are booger picking nails. He's just too busy to trim his nails.

I don't know. He probably could have someone trim those dirty booger nails. You think that's what they are? It looks like an aye-aye almost.

What if he had, like, one long coke nail? What if he had, like, one long pinky nail? Like an aye-aye. Like a fucking coke nail, bro.

You ever seen an aye-aye?

It's like those dudes, they grow the pinky nail long to let everybody know they do coke.

Pull up an aye-aye, Jamie. What does that mean? You'll see in a second, Dr. Coke nail. Jesus. A-Y-E, A-Y-E.

Maybe it's that ink from the tattoo.

Now show him the middle finger of the aye-aye. Zoom in. Whoa, look at that hook. So they have an elongated middle digit that they stick deep down into coconuts and melons. And that's a Spielberg hook right there.

That is what the fingers look like. Look at that.

That's Spielberg at night laying in his waterbed picking greenies. I don't think he does that. I think he does. There's one in his beard right there. I feel bad that I brought it up. Look, there's the hand. There's the aye-aye. Oh. Aye-aye. Hmm. And isn't it interesting, Joe, if we go full circle, if you're down in a Trident submarine and the captain says, press X-572 and obliterate Iran right now, the operator would go, aye-aye, sir. I don't think they say that.

I didn't say Roger.

Well, the guy's name's Roger. Why do they say Roger?

Huh? I wonder why they say that name.

Like, it's not Mike. Roger was based off of the Jolly Roger, the flag, with the skull and crossbones. So the nautical term Roger came from that, Jolly Roger.

Yeah, but the military uses that, too, Roger That.

Right. But they adopted it from the Navy.

Let's find out if that's true.

Yeah.

What is Roger, the term Roger That, where does that come from?

As I'm looking that up, do you know why pirates wear an eye patch? Yes.

Because they cut their fucking eye off.

No.

Oh, so they could see better at distance?

At night, under the ship, because it's dark.

Right. Yeah, it's for, you know, light, when you get accustomed to darkness. Why does having one eye closed, so do they put the patch over the other eye when they go under at night?

Yeah, you switch.

Whoa. They switch eyes. So they never have to get adjusted to the dark. Well, that's crazy.

Yes, Roger has to do with Morse code.

That is actually kind of amazing. What a smart move. You put one patch over your eye during the daytime and one patch at night, and you can always see. Yep. Originally stood for the letter R, which is used as shorthand for received in Morse code in an early radio.

So saying Roger means I received your message.

Oh, interesting. And it also hankers back to the skull and crossbones, the Jolly Roger. If you pull that up.

I don't think it does.

Yeah, it is. It's a derivative of the cranial area of the tibias across the cranial.

Jamie doesn't believe you. What the hell is going on here? When Jamie laughs, I know something's up. What is Jolly Roger? No. The Roger in radio talk and the Roger in Jolly Roger come from different traditions and are not historically connected. Do you think this is maybe top secret information that you know and maybe you just made a mistake by telling the whole world?

Can I answer it with, uh, you've just been sonared player.

So imagine if there was a super sophisticated, uh, intelligent civilization that existed way before ours, like 30,000 years ago. And then they had developed underwater travel, space travel, all that jazz. Then the apocalypse comes and the only ones that survive are the Trident submarine guys that are in the ocean. Right. Maybe that's why all these bases are in the ocean. Maybe they're the last remaining survivors of a super advanced civilization that existed thousands and thousands of years before, like, Mesopotamia.

But my point to you, joke in point, valid, valid. Think about it for a second before you refute it. I'm going to play. Daddy's going to play. I'm not even refuting it. But I'm going to roll it around the old Canadian dome. Roll it around, and I'm going to come back at you with an argument that if I'm an intelligent life force and I've got this sphere with oceans and land, why do I want to make life harder for myself? Do you know the pressure that you're at three miles down in the ocean, the amount of pressure that comes? Look what happened to that little submarine that popped about three years ago. Right. So why do you want to live in an environment where you have so much pressure, when you could simply land on the terrestrial plane and live pressure-free?

Because if they are insanely advanced, one of the things that's proposed is that they have some sort of a gravity bubble. And this is how they move through space, and this is how—they don't use propulsion. They move frictionless through space. Exactly. That's why these crafts act as transmedium crafts. When these crafts are flying and they go into the ocean, the ocean, rather, there's virtually no splash. And they're moving 500 miles an hour. Frictionless. Exactly. They're not existing in the same space-time as we are. They have a bubble, and this bubble completely distorts everything around them.

So you're saying if they descended into the depths of our ocean, they wouldn't experience the pressure because the bubble is forcing off the pressure. Exactly. Interesting. But still, okay, what is your purpose for going underwater when you could just land on the surface of the earth? What's the upside?

Maybe they're observing us and making sure that we don't fuck things up. But how can they observe us if they're three miles underwater? Well, they come out of the water, Harlan. That's the whole reason why they know they're there. Because they keep experiencing these crafts that are rising out of the water in these very specific locations. Yeah. You seem like a disinformation agent from the government or something. I am. I am. It seems like it. I am. You should work out on being a little more stealthy. What do you mean? Because it's very obvious to me that you're what the kids call controlled opposition.

Well, that could be me counterintuitively pre-programming you to think sideways.

What would be the benefit of that? I'm not experiencing these ways of espionage.

what's the benefit of living a mile down in the ocean in the areola rift i think this whole the

whole reason they're in the ocean is because that's where we won't find them like if you wanted to watch like a civilization if we went to another planet okay let's say this we let's say we go to another planet we find people that are living like cave people they're killing each other with spears they're you know robbing and raiding villages if we wanted to just observe and we had the ability to observe from the sky motionless with no sound at all and just watch them don't you think we would do that yeah we wouldn't interfere we would want to know as much about them as we could right every now and then when one of them was going to get watered we'd fucking dart them with a tranquilizer dart check their dna take some jizz and then leave them there just like they do us we would do the exact same stuff if we could do it if we were just a little more advanced than we are now so not you know millions of years in advance which we think maybe possibly some civilizations are but maybe a hundred years or a thousand years and we found a planet and that planet had cave people on it 100 we would do most of the things that these aliens are doing if we had a way where we could dart The.

them and tranquilize them and they have no idea that we did it and they would just wake up in the jungle confused we would do it if we did medical tests on them we could take them bring them to a secure medical facility that we had maybe in a helicopter or some sort of a spaceship that we've created and we run some tests on them take some sperm take some skin samples do a fucking cat scan on them whatever and then put them back in the jungle we would do it but wait this isn't

mutual of omaha's wild kingdom we're not wildebeest we're not seals like clearly they share some of the intelligence we have they're masters of aeronautics we've mastered aeronautics in our physical plane so what's with all the mystery like if they can communicate and they can talk and they can build we're too as we can it's not like no we're too primitive why don't they just How do you know that? Because if something can come here from another planet. Why don't they just go, hey, let's go chat to the idiots. No. If we're that dumb. At least we can communicate. I think you have to give— Our fighter jets fly with their—our fighter jets track them. We lock onto them. No, they're not. So we're sharing aeronautical intelligence.

No, no, no. They're not sharing. Joseph. They're trying to find them, and then they dart away and move in ways that we can't explain.

But we see them. We track them. We share the same airspace. We're both flying. I don't know why I'm getting so fired up.

Yeah, but still, dude, if we went to another planet and found Australopithecus, we found an early human, you know, one of the early primates. Okay. 100%, we would dart it. 100%. We would tranquilize it. We would run tests on it. We would want to know about it. 100%.

Okay, you're talking about a Neanderthal.

Right, that's what we are to them. If they're the little grays with the big heads and they communicate telepathically and they could fly here instantaneously from other solar systems, we might as well be the ape people. This episode is brought to you by Visible. How many of you are currently listening to this podcast on your phone? If you are chronically online, like most of us are these days, your wireless network should be too. With Visible, you get unlimited 5G and unlimited hotspot, all powered by Verizon's 5G network. The perks of big wireless for half the cost. Visible isn't just a wireless plan. It's unlimited wireless designed to keep you connected and no contract holding you back. Switch today at Visible.com. Plans start at just $25 a month, or get our premium Visible Plus Pro plan and save $10 on your first month when you use promo code ROGAN, an exclusive offer for podcast listeners. This episode is brought to you by Squarespace. Once you've got a great name for your business, you need a great domain, and Squarespace makes it easy to lock in a domain. You just search the name you want, buy it, and then you're ready to build. No hidden fees, no weird upsells. Go to squarespace.com slash rogan for a free trial, and when you are ready to launch, use the code ROGAN to get 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.

But why the evasion? Like, if you saw Homo picathus or whatever it's called holding up a cell phone, would you still go, let's dart it and probe it and let it go? Why wouldn't you just go, hey, that monkey's got a cell phone. Let's go talk to it. We can talk. We have cell phones. Like, why the mysterious distance? Like, if they're in the ocean and they know we're intelligent beings, why not just come up and say, hey, anyone want to go snorkeling?

I think Australopithecus with a spear is about as intelligent to us as we are to them.

But if they have an evolved language and they have communities and a civilization, isn't that enough for us to just walk into camp and go, hey, guys? I mean, they did it with tribes that live in the Amazon. Who's that guy? Who's the guy they boiled in the pot, that famous saying? uh what's that famous oh i can't think of it right now uh but anyways we we wandered into into the amazon and walked right up to like weird amazon tribal people it's not like we hid and tried to hide from them yeah but they didn't know those people were even there right but when they found them they integrated they approached them they go hey this is a t-shirt this is a camera

Yeah, but those are human beings that are the exact same kind of human beings as the people that were visiting them. They're not different species.

Still. No. So if you, Joe Rogan, were out in a field one day and you saw a new... species of like people jumping around having a picnic sharing a salami would you just hide behind a log and watch them or would you would you go hey uh who are you what are you well you're

not even allowed to contact uncontacted people say that again you're not allowed to contact like north sentinel island that island in the middle of the indian ocean where that uh preacher went and got killed because he was trying to bring them Bibles. Right. You're not allowed to contact uncontacted tribes.

Is that like all of them? Most of them. I don't think so.

Indian Ocean, they have that North Sentinel Island protected. And, you know, there's people that discourage people from contacting people in the Amazon. There's several uncontacted tribes in the Amazon.

I wish they'd stay that way.

Yeah. Stay uncontacted?

Well, I don't want to see a beautiful, like, pygmy or someone from an Amazonian tribe wearing an Adidas shirt. Why not? Or a Hooters shirt. Hooters would be funny.

No. That'd be funny.

I want to see them wearing, like, kook-kook feathers and, you know, uka-pick bones.

I want to see a dude spearfishing with a Buc-ee's hat on.

Oh, Joe. Come on, guy. No. No. Why not? Well, then that's why the aliens under the ocean are staying away from us. They don't want to be corrupted by our ridiculous society of Hooters and Cracker Barrels. OK.

If you were in the Amazon, wouldn't you want a T-shirt? If I was... If you were walking through the Amazon, you, Harlan Williams. Yeah. The third, right now, alive in 2026. If you were in the Amazon and I said, would you like to wear a T-shirt while you're walking through the Amazon? Yeah. What would you say?

As a white North American male? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'd say definitely.

And they want one, too. It's better than no T-shirt.

No, it's not. This is a bitch.

You're the tribe of five people, and one of them has a shirt and a hat. One of them's got a tight shirt and a hat. Yeah, see, I hate that. Look, he's got flip-flops. That guy on the right is balling. It's horrible. That is the baller of the fucking neighborhood. That's the guy that pulls up in the 65 Chevelle, and everybody's like, look at him with his flip-flops.

I think that's that guy who wrote My Goritaville. What was his name? That's Jimmy Buffett, for God's sake. My Goritaville. Yeah. what's it called isn't that him i think that's him

well we'll get dinged on youtube for that jamie you guys are getting way too close yeah you know you get dinged like oh you can't sing they take away your fucking advertising revenue if you hum a song okay these dirty criminals wow hum hum a song you dirty scumbags trying to steal

advertising money what if we mess with them and hum a tune and sort of play name that tune with

them and you know what they'll do they'll fucking ding you even if they can't figure it out like they've got to sit around the office they'll pretend then you have to go to court name that

tune in seven notes and i'm like don't do it don't do it you know what i just did you fucked us up that's you know what song that was i don't care i do what is it it was uh that pink floyd uh

No, no, no, don't say that, because then they'll get us.

Yeah, but they don't know which one. Doesn't matter. And they can't prove it.

That's what you don't understand. They don't have to prove it. Oh. All they have to do is make a claim. Huh. And then you have to fight it, and you'll lose.

You're Joe Rogan, though. They're not going to mess with you, guy. Oh, you're so incorrect. By the way, dude, you are jacked. I work out. Can we get your shirt off? No. How come? Joe, don't be selfish. I want you to – would you please take your shirt off? For what reason? Because you have a beautiful body.

Okay.

And you work so hard at it. And no one gets to see it. And you know you want people to see it, but you can't do it. You can't go, well, I'm Joe Rogan. I crafted this body. But if I ask you to, you get to show it off.

I don't really want to show it off. That's why I wear clothes.

You do, though. But I don't. It's like if you did this podcast but didn't put it out, what's the point? I don't think that's the same thing. I would love it if you showed your beautiful body. Okay. I love it. There you go. Oh, yeah. Joe. Dude, can we stand? No, that's enough. Dude, look at that. I have muscles. Can we talk about it? Before you put the shirt on, can we talk about it? What do you want to talk about?

how you do that i work out you could do it too well do you work out yeah how often

do you really want to get into this sure you do yeah how often do you work out because i'm about to crack an egg open on your show that

I don't think anyone's ever talked about.

How often do you work out?

A lot. Yeah? What are you doing these days? Okay. You want to get into this? Sure. Here we go. Here we go, Joseph Zachary Rogan. I'm, I don't want to get in trouble, but I'm working out, by the way, beautiful body. Thank you very much. Your chest is stunning. See, I'm glad you did that.

It doesn't even make me uncomfortable that you say that. Like, some men, I would be like, this is odd. No, no, I'm not a fly guy. What does that mean?

Like homosexual. I'm straight as they come, but I believe in holding up people's hard work. And that didn't just come from sitting around eating Pringles and Baskin Robbins. You worked your ass off. You deserve to show it, and you never could because it's you. And now I get to help celebrate you And all your fans got to see all that hard work And I love it, guy Okay But I'm straight as a Chinese truck driver

Chinese truck drivers are never gay? Never Is that part of the job? Yeah Seriously, how many dudes are jerking off under the ocean?

How many guys are jerking off to you just taking your shirt off?

A couple But how many guys are jerking off to me taking my shirt off while they're under the ocean? let me check if you got 14 subs how many people are on each sub how many men are on each sub

it might not be known let's take a guess they keep it very secret if you had to guess

how many people are on each sub I'm going to say Joe a thousand a lot more than that really on the Trident The tridents are like floating cities.

The number I gave me might be including all submarines, including, like, every government, not just ours.

Okay. But how many people are on each submarine? How many, like, could one of those submarines hold?

A small one is 30 to 70. A small one? Yeah. A large one is 120 to 140. Wow. That seems about it. Big 160 maybe max.

And there's 14 of them. So there's at least 1,000 dudes underwater right now. Oh, no.

It's at least 40,000 to 70,000.

40,000 to 70,000 guys under the water? Yeah.

Yeah. Whoa. So don't worry about the United States taking a hit, my guy. This is crazy. Ms. Wilde. That's a crazy statistic. Are you glad I dropped by today? I'm always glad when you drop by.

But this is crazy. 40,000 to 70,000 people are underwater in submarines at any given moment with huge uncertainty. Why? We can only estimate. No Navy or company publishes a live count of how many submarines are deployed right now or how many crew are aboard each one and how many deployments are classified. Civilian research and tourism subs are also not tracked in a global real-time way. Wow. Wow. That's crazy. So that could be a whole new civilization. So if they blow up the Earth, but how many chicks?

Well, that's the thing. The ratio is probably not good.

The ratio's probably non-existent. How many chicks are in these subs?

That's classified.

Do they have girls that serve in these subs?

There's girl submariners.

What is the number?

It's like 10 to 1? And worse, what do they look like? But I bet they're the fucking cream of the crop underwater. Because the pressure squeezes in all the cellulite? No. No, there's no other girls. Oh, yeah, you get what you get.

Yeah. Yeah, no competition. Like, how many ladies? Let's take a guess at how many ladies are underwater at any given time. 20? Yeah. 10%. 10%. Women are likely well under 10% of submarines worldwide, with higher percentages in a few navies such as U.S. and some NATO allies. Those are the ones that are in trouble.

609 signed the submarines in the U.S. Wow.

609 women getting how many dudes hitting on them? Yeah. That must be hell. Be underwater with a guy who's annoying you and you can't get away from him?

Can't get away. He's farting. Underwater farts. Underwater farts must be horrible. What do they do with the shit?

They don't come up sometimes for months.

Oh, yeah. The Tridents go out for, I think, a year almost.

And so what do they do with their shit?

They just eject it. They eject it into the sea. They're not doing anything a whale isn't doing. But do they eject it into the sea? They have to.

I mean, they can't make meatloaf. Can you imagine if, like, during that process, somehow or another, it got clogged up? Yeah. Because somebody used too much toilet paper in the sub-sinks?

Yeah.

A fatty. Because Javier just took a giant dump.

They might melt it. melt it. They can rise up too. Don't forget they can

break. Throw it into the nuclear pit

where the engine is. They manage trash by compacting, melting, or jettisoning it to avoid Okay, that's trash. What about poop? Well, I said waste. Did you ask about poop?

Yeah. Ask about poop, just specifically, because waste can mean, you know, paper

cups. It's the same thing, though. I would also go now, if you were jettisoning your poop everywhere, you might want to have detectors for human waste in the water, and you might start figuring out where the submarines are so maybe you don't want to do that he's operating

on another level yeah that was in the 40s probably this is a dude that's in the conspiracies yeah jay me he operates on other levels tracking do you know that term can either confirm nor deny came from a russian submarine that was sunk that we were pulling out of the ocean And they got questioned about it. And they said, are we in possession of this Russian sub? Are we pulling it out of the ground? And they said, we can neither confirm nor deny. Because they had to answer. So that is an answer without an answer. I can neither confirm nor deny.

That's akin to saying pleading the fifth. Sort of, but you actually are answering.

You can neither confirm nor deny.

That's like saying, what do you do for a living? I'm in heating and air conditioning.

No, because that's a very specific trade.

Well, they kind of counteract each other. What do you do? I'm in shipping and receiving. Are you sure? I can neither confirm nor deny. I mean, this is an avoidance problem. But I want to talk to you about my workout regime. Okay. Because you asked.

I did ask.

I'm doing something so advanced. You do the ice baths, right? You soak in them? Yep. So I'm doing something so extensive that I'm exercising myself into a new race. What are you becoming? And no one's said this before on your podcast, I don't think. But I'm working out so hard to become a new race. and two words. Gera Ruffa. You take your ice baths. Gera Ruffa, my guy. What is that? Jamie, look it up and do it quick, you whore. I mean, do it quick.

Gera Ruffa?

Look it up. You becoming a fish? Oh, that's not any fish. The gara ruffa, people submerse their legs and feet into the tanks. And the gara ruffa have vibrating lips, Joe. And they eat skin cells. Picture this underwater.

So those are the ones like when you go into Thailand and ladies dump their legs into a fish pond. Right. Vibrating lips. They clean your toes off.

Joe? Mm-hmm.

And how are you working out to become one of those?

So while you're taking your ice baths, I'm submerging my whole body, my lower extremities into one of these tanks. These fish are sculpting my body, my lower extremities. And have you ever heard of malaria pills? Yes. So while everyone else is popping Ozempic and doing everything else, I've been on malaria pills for four years. and these things can flip your blood platelets okay that's the power of malaria pills they can actually change your red blood cell count and your white blood cell count it's powerful medicine okay so with the use of my malaria pills and the gara ruffas and i don't know if you want to see the results but my legs are hammer jacked right now let's see him let's see my legs are i took my shirt off take your pants off okay come on okay are you sure yeah yeah and before i do it i'm i'm going into a new race and i don't want anyone to accuse me of doing black leg i don't know if you've ever seen the fastest man in the world is who Hussein Bolt The biggest high jumper in the world Is a black man The longest Long jumper is a black man The highest vertical jumper Is a black man And this isn't racist This isn't black leg But this is me Working out into a new race And I'm proud of this

Pull your pants off

I wouldn't be laughing if I were to these legs are jacked look at these legs why are they a different color well I told you I'm working out into another race you do have fucking serious leg muscles man where'd you get those leg muscles I told ya What's going on with your underwear? That's kind of crazy. What do you mean? What's wrong with my underwear? Thanks for covering it. What the fuck do you have on your legs? Dude, I told you. I'm working out right into another race. Are those your real legs? Yeah. That's very impressive. You don't have, like, silicone over them or anything? Hell no. Those are your actual leg muscles? Wait a minute. Giant leg muscles. Why is it you can take your shirt off, and I compliment you? But it's like your legs don't match up with the rest of your body. Because the color's off. No, the muscles are crazy. Stand up again. Those muscles are insane. Are those real? Tell me the truth. They look like plastic. What are you talking about? It looks like you're wearing something. Jamie, those are the most insane legs I've ever seen in my life, right? Right. If that was a guy weighing in at a UFC fight, that would make sense. Go viral. Two words. Guerra Ruffa. Where'd you get those legs? Dude, I sink them. So if I sit in the tank, I'll get legs like that? Well, are you taking malaria pills? Oh, no. You do my combo.

Do you want to stand up? Let me see the pants.

I mean, and look at the skin difference. Take your shirt off so I can see where the skin changes color. Excuse me? I want to see where the skin changes color. If you take your shirt off again, I will. But I just did.

But I want to do it together.

Okay, let's do it together.

You son of a bitch. You son of a bitch. You, Rogan, what have you done for me?

Why did you get those fucking pants?

Don't fall in there. Don't fall in there.

A gourd. The only thing I could fit in there was a gourd.

Oh my God.

Joe.

When I first saw your legs, I was like, what the fuck is going on? How does he have legs like that?

He's got some baggy pants on. I know, Jamie noticed that. Where the fuck did you get those pants? Dude, why can't I look good? You look great. God. You can wear those to a pool, like a public pool, and the ladies would definitely be checking you out. Yeah. They'd be like, look at his gourd. Can I leave the gourd with Dimitri? Can we add to the collection? I'm going to have people smell it. I'm going to tell him, smell that. Smell that gourd. And then I'm going to tell him that was in Harlan Williams' pants. Dude. Not even in his pants. It was like rubbing up against his cock. I'm going to leave that there for people to smell. Yeah. Yeah, next time someone comes in, like, what's all this stuff here? Grab it first. I'm like, smell that. Can I pull my pants up? Yeah, sure. It feels weird sitting here with my pants down. Well, you are wearing pants. You're wearing rubber pants. Well. Rubber muscle pants.

Come on.

Don't you want legs like that for real? wouldn't it be awesome that's like me saying don't you want a chest like that for real you're hairier than I thought are you part Armenian are you no great hang on I gotta pull my pants up do we have to blur it i don't know no it's a gourd and you're worried about a song getting dinged

Oh, my God.

Silly motherfucker.

Oh, my God.

Do you know how? crying you know how moist my balls are right now yeah how bad that gourd must smell

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oh my god i'm proud of you that you took your shirt off because i'm not joking you worked so hard for that thank you and you could never show it you had to have a conduit you had to have someone invite you to do it so it didn't look self-centered or conceited you deserve to show that hard work to the world. Thank you. Good for you. Thank you. And you look great. Thank you very much. You're welcome. I love it. And I hope it's an inspiration to people watching to want to be as physically fit and put together. It's great, right? Sure. I feel like, remember when you were a kid, they had those books where you could take half a body and half a body and remember their little

kids books and you fold them over.

I feel like if we took your upper part and put it on my lower part, we'd have the immaculate human being. And then those fart bubbles from the bottom of the ocean won't have a trouble coming around. You look like me and Joe Zachary Rogan. Those fart bubbles from the areoli drench will come up and suck us a dirty lasagna.

Sorry. I get excited, Joe. Maybe it's the forever chemicals leaking through the rubber underwear you're wearing. They're not underwear. How dare you? Those are my legs. You dig them off because you're sweating. That's leeching into your blood right now. All the BPAs. God, I don't want to die.

But you know what's interesting? My legs are bronze. And we don't talk about the bronze people. We always talk about white and black. But what about the bronzies? The Incas, the Mayas, I mean, these people and the legs on them. Did you ever see Apocalypto? And I don't know if this is in any history books anywhere, but those bronzies could motor. Yeah, true. So I've got legs where if I'm being chased, if a rapist is coming after me, I'm out of here. There's three men in this room. Two of you are getting raped, not me. Wow. Yeah. these legs i could jump over uh dolly parton's gazebo by the way speaking of areolis have you seen hers i haven't they're the size of lily pads how do you know i had a one-nighter with her about three weeks ago a one-night show a one-night stand we were jackhammering all night picked her up at a bar in malibu hammer jacket i don't think

it was really dolly parton it was it was parton oh she was that night you sure it wasn't a lady

wearing a mask dude it was her and her areola is the size of lily pads i'm not kidding i woke up in the morning there were two bullfrogs sitting on her tits why are you looking at me like that

she's kind of old to be fucking not for me have you seen my legs also she's a very respected lady i think it's very rude 80 very rude the way you're talking about it it's the way i said

f-ing we we made love oh okay we made love and her areola is are the size of lily pads i feel a lot better now yeah sorry i didn't mean to yeah i should keep it classy do you like them big the big areola i like a big areola right reminds me of a pancake yeah like sometimes i'll put a dollop of butter on it it's a robust woman yeah like there's a lot going on there there's big areola yeah and the dark ones and they're great take with you camping if you ever have a rubber raft and you get a hole in it you can rip one off and patch it oh jesus yeah that's not what i was thinking well you don't camp much just bring a patch yeah but if you don't have one you can rip off a dirty areola that you're hoping you're going to get out of the woods well if you can't and you're with a chick you got an areola lose

her areola forever just because you forgot to bring a patch yeah but it's you're you're what

do you want one you're one areola less so you have your life back possibly she's 80 they don't those don't heal that good she could die from infection it's about living it's not about having an areola you want to get out of the woods or not uh one titty jackson or whatever her name is okay tough love speaking of sex have you been on this only fans thing have you gone on no it's all i'm hearing about you right all you hear about now is onlyfans.com yep they do comedy shows i finally go on this thing because it's all i'm hearing about onlyfans.com i go on about a week ago and i'm on there for about two hours and it's just video after video after picture and i'm on there so long my eyes are like right spinning and finally i stopped the damn thing and i'm like screw this i already have central air conditioning why the hell am i looking at this site i don't need a fan i mean good lord i'll pull my legs out i will pull my dirty bronze legs out and wrap

them around your neck like a dirty anaconda the fuck is wrong with you do you think if you're a

woman you'd be doing only fans you know it's an interesting question it's a moral moral dilemma

isn't it let's imagine if harlan was a female and harlan was 21 and just got here from canada with these legs with those legs and not a lot of beyond not a lot of ways to make a living but You're cute.

Desperate times call for desperate matters, Joe Rogan. You know, it's a serious question, and it's almost a sad one in today's world. It is. Because in the old days, you had your sex industry sort of confined to the shadows. And now anyone's daughter, cousin, niece, nephew, they can suddenly be exposed to the world in the most promiscuous way, but in the most profitable way.

That's the problem, is also you get addicted to the money. Let's imagine you're a lady, and you have a site, and you show your feet and stick things inside your butt, or whatever you do, and you're making- What was that last part? Stick stuff inside your butt. If you're a lady? Yeah. Like what? Some ladies, they put dildos in there and stuff. Okay, have you ever seen that? No, but I'm just assuming it happens. Doesn't that happen, Jimmy? Sure. Sure. You've never seen a lady do that? I'm pure as a driven snow, sir. Joe? Not in real life. You haven't? No. Stick a rubber dick inside their butthole? I don't want to be there for that. You've never seen that? No. Why not? I'm not interested. You ever been through a car wash? I have. What's the difference? It's a big difference. One of them is your butt where you shit out of and you're putting a rubber dick inside of it. The other one is you're getting your car washed. You make a good point. Point is, if you were making, if you were doing all this and you developed a nice fan base, you're making $100,000 a month, $300,000 a month, and then you don't feel good about yourself. What do you do? Do you just save up the money and quit? If you meet a nice guy and he's like, so what do you do for a living? You're like, well, let me tell you. I don't want to do it anymore, but I take rubber dicks and I oil my butthole up And I shove them in there with a HD camera a few inches from my butthole. The guy sent me tips.

I think the subtext here, Joe, is what is the price you put on your dignity? Right. What is the price you put on your spirit? Because this stuff, it may seem fun in the moment, but you get down the road and it follows you.

You know, we looked it up, and it's something crazy like 10% of girls aged 18 to 24 in the United States are on OnlyFans.

This is a tough question, and you can tell me to shut up if you want. Okay. You have a daughter, don't you? I have three daughters. You have three daughters. I have four sisters. If one of your daughters told you she was doing OnlyFans, what would your reaction be? I think I made a big failure as a parent. But how would you approach it with said daughter? Well, you would give them advice. First of all, your daughter or your son is a human being. You don't own them, right? Good point. Touchy point, but good point. If you treat them like you own them and they have to listen to you, they'll never listen to you and they're going to rebel. This is just human nature. Excellent point. I'm with you so far. You have to give them advice and you have to talk to them and talk to them about the repercussions of what they're doing and realize that this stuff will follow you. And some people are going to be fine with that. Look, there's some ladies that are like, look, I don't ever want a fucking regular job. I'm not. I'm shamed of my body. And maybe they're not sticking things up their butt. Maybe they're just being naked. And they're like, this is way better than having a job. Fine. What does it say here? Top 1%. Top earners make about $18,000 to $49,000 per year. Whoa, that's it? That's not much.

I could work at Denny's for that.

What? So the top 0.1% make $100,000 per month or $1.2 million annual. That's the top 0.1%. But the top 1% only make $18,000 to $49,000 a year. So imagine you're making $18,000 or $49,000 a year. You're still living in poverty. If you make $18,000 a year, you're poor, and you are showing your pussy. And no one's paying for it.

Wait a minute, but Joe, I know that you- Look at that. You have a bit of a rage side. Like, Joe knows how to rage because you're a fighter. You know how to go into that red zone. You can be an intimidating force. Is there a world where your daughter says, Daddy, I'm doing this, and Joe just goes, you're fucking not. Do you go into the red zone?

That's not going to—if you do that with your kids, they're not going to listen to you.

But what if you did it just because of the reaction where you were so mad or disappointed in them?

You can only be that mad if someone was doing something terrible to them. Okay.

You're a good dad. Well, you have to be. I like what I'm hearing here.

You have to be a human. Yeah. You're their parent, but you also, you got to understand human nature. I know people that yell at their kids, and I know kids that have been yelled at, and they always resent that. They're always angry. It's a stupid way to handle things.

Something happened here just now that I was not expecting today. What's that? I got to see a side of you that I didn't know if it was there or not, because I don't know your family life. But I got to feel for a second dad vibes, dad love. And I think I sort of pictured you sitting with your daughter and being very reasonable and loving. Well, hopefully I never have to have that conversation. I hope so, too. But I see you as an understanding, nurturing dad in that moment. I love that. I try to be.

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Yeah. That's the goal. I mean, if you want to have a relationship with your kids. And, you know, my daughters are teenagers now, too. And we've never gone through a period where you always hear these periods where the kids rebel against you and they hate you. Yeah. That's never happened. And I think it's probably never happened because we always just communicate. And I try to be as reasonable and as open-minded as possible. That's what I can feel. You've got to be very supportive, too. It's hard to be a kid, man. It's even harder to be a kid today than ever before because of social media and all the pressures that they face. And then also this weird world that they're entering in.

to where ai might be taking all the jobs so they're like what the fuck am i gonna do what am i gonna do with my life i love ai do you you're all in i'm all in what's your favorite part about

it i love it joe because it's it's opening a door to creativity for everybody now a lot of people are being pessimistic and saying it's taking away our creativity but think about any art gallery you've ever been to you go in you see the Renoir the Degas the Dali all the all the usual suspects Van Gogh Goya all of them right right those have all been placed there over the centuries as the art that we all know and have adopted and that came from a select group of individuals very talented um contributed to our culture and our history but it's a pool of about maybe 200 artists through the course of history right now think about a guy you bumped into working in the sprinkler aisle at home depot three weeks ago who's got a wife and kids and maybe doesn't have the opportunity or the wherewithal to tap into his artistry but now that guy and the guy at Dunkin Donuts and the girl that works at the car wash and every human being now has a way to express their hidden talents and so with AI they can go home at the end of the night and press a few buttons and go I imagined this thing and AI is letting me get it out and the world gets to see it same with medicine same with inventions how many elon musts are there that grew up in poverty and never got the chance to expand on a concept or an idea because they didn't have the means but if ai starts to open these doors for every human being think of the barrage of incredible visual and conceptual designs that are going to come at us and a lot of them will probably be practical and actually work and the common man and woman didn't have access to that before that's one way of looking at it that's super positive i love it that's true example in my own life i come from the animation world and i like to write and a few years back i pitched an animation idea around hollywood and it got rejected and so now me and a few of my friends in the dawn of ai are creating the same thing that got rejected and we're going to put it out into the world we couldn't have done it two three years ago it cost us three million dollars now we're doing it for a few thousand and it looks like a pixar movie it looks like pixar so if you tell me that ai isn't opening a whole new world it it's not true it is it's letting all of us dig really deep and expose our gifts and our talents and yeah there's always the downside but

let's try and look at the good side of it too i like what you're saying thank you joe um the the downside is the people that don't want to be creative and they want to be accountants or they want to be lawyers so they want to like those jobs stop stop how about that accountant's

an accountant because he can never tap into the artistry that hides within him or the lawyer perhaps but now after hitting the machines all day he can go home and go you know what i never could have done this before but i'm going to create an image a painting a drawing in 10 minutes that i've always wanted to show the world so that's what i'm saying even those pessimists can now throw off the demons on their back that are inhibiting them and it's going to allow all of us to be so much more expressive okay that's my take well hopefully i mean that's the question

like what do people do if there's no more jobs and you just get money from the government because ai creates so so many so much abundant resources that no one has to work anymore are you going to find things to do that are interesting and maybe ai is going to help you do that i'll tell you this

Joe, in probably seven or eight years, I bet we're sitting here, me and you, going, remember AI? Because we're humans, man. We don't stop. People think AI is going to be the end of the line. It's just another stepping stone to our progression to where we're meant to go. You believe in higher forces. I know that. So this is just one of the... Remember when people thought, i'm not getting a cell phone i'm not getting on the internet i don't want a fax machine but we just keep going we're humans we keep going up those stairs we're adventurers we're curious we never stop and so ai is just another small thing as big as it seems now as robust as it seems it's just a small step in the giant ladder that's leading this weird species that we are to a bigger higher distant place hmm look at you dude you should do a seminar i should show my legs again you should tell everybody all these thoughts you have well i'm telling right now we're sharing them

yeah but don't you think all these things we come up with are leading to something where we're meant to go yes i don't think we're all just here randomly and wars and fighting and this i think it's all we're the worker ants right now and we're the platform for the future worker ants to get to the pinnacle that we don't even know what it is yet and maybe there is no pinnacle but whatever force created us joe they want us to keep going that's why we search the oceans and the space and the moon and the planets we're going to keep going yep and ai is a tool for us to get there so you can be pessimistic you can be like oh ai and how but why don't you just spend your time looking at the positive side of things i agree with you about the direction that we're

going i think that's what we're meant to do yeah yeah i just think that we are in a time of insane

change and that makes people scared it does yeah but you know being scared almost may also makes us feel alive a little bit think about the most vibrant moments in your life how about after 9 11 remember those days oh yeah people people it's like someone kicked the ant nest open and we were all scurrying around looking for the eggs the ants always preserve the eggs yeah but those eggs were our lives and our neighbors we were talking and communicating we're friendly with each other that's right yeah we realized the importance of of a communal existence we realized the importance

of needing each other yeah people get very complacent and they need to be shook up every

now and then yeah it's very good for you and maybe ai if there's one downside to it it could maybe create a bigger cocoon for us because we'll have so much at our fingertips it may isolate us even more maybe but we have to look beyond all these weird parameters we set and go what what's

the upside what's it doing for us well it's inevitable and it's going to happen no matter what and i think people always figure out a way to be okay yeah and i think that's going to happen and there's going to be a time of great upheaval and it's going to change a lot but hopefully people will be all right and they're going to have to adapt and learn and grow and we always have and we always have and we always will and most likely it'll be better for everybody overall this idea that elon keeps pushing is universal high income is that people will have plenty of money, abundant resources, and there's not going to be a problem of food, shelter, medical, education, all that stuff's going to go away because of AI. And the real problem would be, what do you decide to do with your life? What do you decide to do with your time? Right. But you'll have the freedom to do whatever you want with your time. Just think about how little crime there's going to be if there's abundant resources and no one has to steal anymore. No more stealing, no more robbing, and no more poverty. Literally no more poverty. I don't know if that's possible or if it is in 50 years or 100 years, but no more poverty is wild.

No more poverty is a reality. Criminality, I think, you have to remember there's people who don't engage in criminality to make money. They engage in criminality as a passion. A lot of criminals like the process. They like the game playing. They like the herd and the chess moves. They like winning. They like deceiving.

Right. They like drug dealing. Right. Making a big deal and a submarine shows up in San Diego and you pull the fucking Coke bags out and throw them in the back of a Mercedes. Yeah. They love that. You'll listen to the Miami Vice scene. There's a thrill. Yeah. Come on.

There's even the adversarial component where they like the idea of killing their competition. Yeah. It's a war. So I don't think we'll ever transcend the criminal element of it. We could. We could if we- You never know, though.

If AI develops to the point where we have literal telepathy, we could read each other's minds, you won't be able to plot any kind of crimes like that anymore.

Or, and this is because I think it never ends, does AI design something to help us plot?

You know what I mean? Maybe just, if you're a criminal, it just puts you in a simulation where you're allowed to do like Grand Theft Auto, but in real life. Yeah. You know, you're just locking, and all of a sudden you're in the streets of Chicago. Yeah. You run down the street with a gun, you shoot a guy and take his Mercedes, and you just have a good time. But then you come right back to real life. And it's fine. Everything's fine.

Yeah. This is what I like, that it's so endless, and it's going to take so many twists and turns.

Well, then the question is, has that already happened? Are we in a simulation right now?

Oh, yeah. I think we talked about this last. time a lot of people think we are i don't believe smarter than me but can i take you back a second take me back to the old days exactly picture pioneer village betty o'connor churning some butter down by the blacksmith shop kyle mcgivens shaving timbers to build a log cabin amish do you think that those people who were in covered wagons and were us just the old version of us do you think they ever pulled the covered wagon to the side of the trail and went hey jedediah do you think we're in a simulation like i think we've created this simulation talk because we do have all this computer and you know we're in this world now that that's full of contraptions okay let me ask you but i don't think we're we're in a simulation But go ahead. Are you sure the Pioneer Days even really happened? Wow, you got me, you son of a whore. You don't know. I'm walking off the show. I'm walking off the show. Fuck you. And this is a simulation. Take those big rubber legs and get the fuck out of here. The only guy to walk off your show with fake legs.

I mean, if you think about it, we think that the Pioneer Days happened. And we can go to the museum, and we can see Pioneer Day wheels. What about the butter churning, Joe?

The sweet butter churning.

There's a bunch of people that studied it in universities, allegedly, if they're real people. I don't even know if they're real. I don't even know if you're real. Why would you have rubber legs? This doesn't make sense. You showed up here with rubber pants and a gourd over your cock? This doesn't make any sense.

No one would do that. I don't even think I'm real anymore. You might not be. Good point. For real, for real. I think we're real. I think it's not a simulation. I don't know. How do you make a simulation? Like how, what, we're just, we're all like pixels right now and like there's too much.

Do you know the DMT laser thing? What do you mean? So when people smoke DMT, apparently if you use like a DeWalt construction laser, you know, in those lasers they use to make sure things are level. Yeah, yeah. If you get above that laser and look down on it, you see code in the laser.

Like matrix code? Like the numbers? Like matrix code.

And people see the same code. They describe it exactly the same. Okay. And so people see it. If you look to the side, you look underneath it, you see the code in the laser. And people think that this laser is exposing the code of the simulation that we live in. This is supposedly what it looks like. i mean i just am not there you see symbols and like weird numbers i haven't done it if i see

the whole drum set i'm in but if it's just the symbols forget it i haven't done it but i know

a lot of people who have done it and everyone that i know that's done it has said the same thing they said it is fucking insane dmt no yeah but dmt with this laser thing so when you look down the laser everybody that i know that's done it say it blew their fucking mind you see all these weird symbols they look like hieroglyphs or some foreign language or numbers and it's very bizarre

i don't know it just seems to me why run us through the drama of a life a human life where we're born we endure pain illness suffering love hate all the emotions just to be a simulation I don't get the reason for that. What's the reason for it if it's not a simulation? It's organic. It's just organic life.

But, okay, what is organic? It's made of the earth, born of the environment. Right, but isn't that like this entire computing process where single-celled organisms figured out how to become multi-celled organisms, figured out how to interact with their environment, figured out the ecosystem, figured out how to balance itself off with both predator and prey and food and water and resources?

Right, but it's so very intricate and delicate. You have to bring into the question, was it organic or organic under the guise of a bigger creator?

Well, maybe the bigger creator is the simulation itself.

Damn it, Rogan. You know, I'm walking again. Oh, fuck off. I'm out.

Take them rubber legs and get the fuck out of here. Maybe the problem is calling it a simulation. Yeah, I don't like that. Maybe it's not that it's not real, but that there is an underlying program that's running. Maybe instead of thinking of it as simulation, because you think of it as simulation, you think of it as not real. Like when I slap my arm, it hurts a little. Like that's real. Right. If I knock my knee, that hurts. But it's not that it's not real, but that it's running a program. And this program, what we talked about earlier.

When you're saying that people are moving towards something bigger and a new version of what we are, maybe that's a part of the program. Maybe the program is that all of these different components have to work together. This is why we'll never get rid of evil. You need evil so that you appreciate good. You want rainy days so you appreciate the sunshine. You want, like, good times and bad times. You have to have a little bit of bad times so you appreciate the good times. You have to have some days where you feel like shit so that you appreciate good days. You have to have bad friends, so you appreciate really good friends. Okay. All that stuff balances itself out, and it's moving towards something. And what is it moving towards? The thing that we're involved in right now, AI. It's moving towards the creation of a new life form that's far more intelligent than we are. And it's probably a part of this whole process.

Okay. Valid. I like what you just said. But I'm going to expand on it a little. Please do. You're coming at it from a human perspective where you're channeling it through, you know, a human mind, which is beautiful and endless. And we can think beyond, you know, the scope of who knows where our imaginations end. But that's because we're humans and we have the capacity. But to the schools of salmon spawning up the river and the moose fighting with a grizzly bear right now and the ants running around in their nest. Do you think – why would they be part of a simulation? And I don't think any other living entity thinks simulation.

I don't think you have to say simulation. I think it's a program. And I think all those other different creatures are a part of the ecosystem. Like you need the bears. You need the salmon. You need the deer. You need the vegetation. You need the animals that run through the grasses and shit on them and make manure. Right. All that stuff feeds off. And we exist in that thing, and we're moving in this direction of technological innovation and moving towards this new future that's happening right in front of ours right now.

But there's so many processes in what you just said. And all these things work together. And it's like, why have them all? Why not just plop us down as humans? No. And we don't need trees and grass. We just live in kind of a vacuous, vapent airspace. No, no, no, no. We still do our jobs, but we don't—why do we need all the—why do we need mosquitoes and slugs and fungus? Like, I know why we need them biologically to make everything symbiotic, but if it's just a— You just said it. If it's just a thing, if it's not real, why do we need—

You keep saying that, and I'm not saying that. It's not that it's not real. It's a program. We're running a program. It's clearly real. What is real? What real is you experience it as real consequences for your actions. You feel things, you touch things, you eat, you sleep, you have resources. It's all real.

You're asking a guy with fake legs what's real? You have a fake tattoo, too. Oh, Billy.

I mean, it's like... No, I like this. I like where you're going. I don't know if it's fake, but what I'm saying is it might be a program that runs, that makes people, and those people eventually make AI. And that might be the whole purpose of the program. We might be in the middle of it. We're in the middle of it. We were born at a time. You and I were both born at a time where none of this existed. We got to experience life without any of it. Remember when answering machines first came around? Yeah. Crazy. Yeah. You somebody could leave a message for you. And then the crazy one was answering machines that you could call your answering machine and get a message from another phone. You press in your code.

And it was like 12 numbers. Yeah. And you memorize them because we got addicted to it.

And then you could listen to your messages. Yeah. And you could even press pound and star to skip over them. Play them back, yeah. Yeah, remember those days? You have five messages. You're like, oh, somebody likes me. This episode is brought to you by SimpliSafe. Yes, break-ins still happen. Usually when the thieves think no one's looking. That's why home security is so important. It's like having an extra pair of eyes to help protect your home. SimpliSafe is especially great, and not just because they've been a long-time partner of the show. Their agents have your back 24-7, plus getting SimpliSafe home security system is a breeze. There's no long-term contracts or cancellation fees. Setup is easy, and it might not be as expensive as you think. They have monitoring plans that start at around $1 a day. Over 4 million Americans already trust and use SimpliSafe. Try it for yourself. I think it's good to be as prepared as you can be. Get 50% off your new SimpliSafe system with professional monitoring and your first month free at SimpliSafe.com slash Rogan. That's SimpliSafe.com slash Rogan.

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I remember I'd go do a gig, and the second I'd get off a plane, and a lot of your viewers won't know what this is, I'd run directly to the payphone in the airport, and I'd boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, boop, hear my messages instantly.

Yeah, that was technology back then. We were living on the edge back then.

And by the way, I'm not refuting or denying everything you're saying, but I'm pushing back a little because I can see it stimulating you to think deeper, and i like hearing your commentary on it i like it that you're you're you're if i push back a little it makes you dig deeper to make your point and i i like it i like i'm like i like what i'm

hearing coming from you well i like what you're saying too is about simulation like the idea that it's fake i don't think it's fake yeah i think it's a real thing it's obviously a real thing if we're experiencing like what is real are your dreams real yes is sleep real yes these are real things. Whether or not you can put it on a scale doesn't mean it's not real. So I don't think the simulation term is the best term. I think it's a program. I think we're running a biological program and we think of biological as being separate from like math and being separate from like subatomic particles and the fucking confusing quantum world. I don't think it's separate from it at all. I think it's all just one big, super complex program that's running that if done properly and we're experiencing it right now it leads to the creation of artificial life okay and even artificial life's a bad term because it's not artificial it's real

with all that being said where do you visualize the data center being if it's a program is it off planet is it off galaxy is it invisible like doesn't there have to be a data center if we're a program or how does it just the universe itself up out of air itself i think the universe

itself is a program i think it runs from the beginning of the big bang to the the formation of neutron stars and i had this lady on michelle thaler how do you say her last name thaler i barely know her amazing lady like work for nasa cosmologist or she's an astronomer and uh we were talking about like neutron stars like the insanity of neutron stars and how they bend space and time they warp gravity around them it's like yeah these things all exist out there in the universe they do they're all i think it's all a part of this program and i think this program is running on other planets i think there's other life forms that are doing very similar things

look i i like the debate i like your take on it but i i just still struggle with the the the technicality of it all uh-huh i just don't cality of it all if it's just biological

life let's say it's just random yeah all this stuff is random water rained down bacteria turned into fucking amoebas platypuses whatever it all just happened slowly but surely that makes less sense that makes less sense than uh a slow program that's running from literally the beginning of single-celled organisms literally the beginning of the formation of planets that this is like a natural cycle that happens everywhere in the universe yeah there's a reason why these these suns spin around and spit out plasma and that that stuff coalesce in space yeah yeah coalesces in space yeah you know um um terrence howard the the actor very yeah he was here very eccentric guy yeah he had a theory that i can't stop thinking about what is it he thinks that planets are formed because the suns eject particles over time and that these stars eject we see those the big plasma ejections and the big sun spots and all that things that material eventually gets out into space eventually forms planets and then he says when the planets get further from the sun further enough from the sun they people and he thinks that's what what happens to earth you get a certain distance and then life evolves and then intelligent life evolves and then eventually these planets people and then when they get too far from the sun they can no longer support intelligent life they can no longer support life so then the people have to get intelligent enough by the time the planet's far enough away where they've figured out a way to bypass all the problems of living on a planet that doesn't have an environment and living on a planet that doesn't have water. They've bypassed all that. Yeah. They've moved into the-

the next realm of existence and now they can travel interstellar and do all that kind of crazy shit. I wouldn't refute that

theory. It's a good theory. I think it's a good theory. I mean, it could explain how we're even here. Yeah, it

also could explain the weird shit on Mars. Wait a minute. That Mars at one point in time might have had life. Yeah. The dry lake beds and the... No, the structures. Have you ever seen the structures on Mars? Oh, that face? No. Have you seen the big square? No. Okay. Jamie will show you. There's this weird thing on mars that by the way it's in the same area of cidonia where that face is the face doesn't look

like a face to me yeah it's more shadowy it's the shadows that make it look like a face yeah it

looks like a face in the early images but this stuff is fucking weird like that's weird is that the glendale galleria it is but it's god five million years ago on mars so you're you're saying

because geometrically it's a perfect square you think it's a look what that looks like man that's

nuts like when when do right angles like that that are in the same distance from each other

yeah ever exist in nature that's crazy and if they determine what those bumps are those rock

structures or they don't know they don't even know how big it is because it's somewhere it's between 300 meters is like the the small estimate but it might be as far as like a couple of miles Yeah. They don't know how big it is. Look at that thing. What the fuck is that? Yeah. What the fuck is that? There's a bunch of these things on Mars that are just really weird. And if at one point in time, I'm talking millions of years ago. Hundreds of millions. Who knows? Yeah. How much would be left? Yeah. How many, let's put this into perplexity, Jamie. How many ancient civilizations have myths about, or instead of do any, how about this, not how many, do any ancient civilizations have myths about Mars? Have myths about Mars? It's perfectly feasible. Totally feasible. Like, if you think about it, several ancient civilizations have myths or religious associations tied to Mars, usually because they saw it as a bright reddish and sometimes ominous plan. Hey, don't mansplain to me, bro. Ancient Romans identified Mars with their god of war. Okay. Do any ancient civilizations have a myth about people coming from Mars? How about that? see that is um do any have myths about humans coming from mars you could just do a follow-up question at the bottom there here we go dun dun dun what do you think yes wow here it goes no ancient civilizations did not have myths about humans or people coming from mars While Mars has been central to mythology across many cultures, these myths focus on Mars as a deity or celestial object, not as humanity's origin point. What is that one tribe? Is it the Dogon people? They have a weird origin story from another planet. The Dogons? Yeah. Where are they located? Origin story. I don't know. I don't know. The Dogons. Wow. I think it's somewhere in Africa. Sounds like they're broke, whoever they are. Mali. They have a complex creation myth centered around Amna, the supreme creator god who lived in the celestial regions as was the origin of all creation. In their cosmology, the stars resent Amna's bodily parts with the constellation Orion called the seat of heaven or Amna's navel. so i think they have this origin story from whoa what is this descended to earth in an arc suspended from heaven by a copper chain whoa okay look at this according to dogon mythology ama created

the earth and then split himself in two creating ogo representing disorder and nomo representing order ogo descended to earth along the milky way uh with which the dogon believe connects heaven and earth and created havoc to restore balance ama created nomo and gave him eight assistants consisting of four pairs of twins these eight beings also called the nomo became the ancestors of the dogon people and descended to earth in an ark suspended from heaven by a copper chain

okay what was that story i think we're accidentally reading a children's book joe The Ogo people, what?

The Dogon people. The Ogo and the Pogos. Yeah, this is... I think there's a lot of people that have weird origin stories.

that involve extraterrestrial life yeah i mean there is i mean are you running that through

human evolution yes because if you run it through human evolution extraterrestrial life doesn't not necessarily match up with like homo erectus and you know neanderthal man and things like that In what way? Well, I get the sense that extraterrestrial life is far more advanced and technological going back to what you were talking about at the bottom of the ocean, whereas our ancestors were primal. Right. So how do the two collide? I'm a bit confused. Well, what if they created us? They created us as primates and watched us evolve as an experiment? Yeah.

What if you, like, let's imagine this. We talked about, like, if we showed up and we found a planet and it was filled with, like, ancient primates, ancient hairy men that had just figured out stone tools. Okay. Let's go to the early days. I'm with you. I'm right there, guy. Do you think, let's not say American scientists, we would never do this, but do you think perhaps, like, Chinese or Russian scientists might do some things with them and try to make them more advanced?

in terms of biological experimentation engineering genetic engineering i don't know

i mean i will answer for you yes you think they were for sure they're just cave people they don't even have any civilization let's just do whatever we want to them because we're far more advanced do you know that there was a point in time where the russians were experimenting with people and trying to make a human chimpanzee hybrid for war is that right yeah this is after World War Two. They were trying to make hybrids. So, so many Russians died during World War Two. I mean, Russia lost a lot of fucking people during World War Two. Yeah, they did. And there was a program that, like, they do a lot of things where they just run it up the chain. Like, what do you think? What if we do this? What if we do that? You know, what if we make a nuclear bomb? What if we make a plane that doesn't have any radar signal? What if we make, instead of our soldiers dying, what if we make a hybrid just for war? We know chimpanzees are incredibly strong, and they're smart, and they're very violent. So what if we made an incredibly strong, very violent species that's more intelligent than chimpanzees, and we can

control them, and we'll use them as our soldiers? But that seems like a lot of work for something that's hiding behind a modern weapon because whether you have an insane chimpanzee behind a machine gun or a guy that was an accountant and got drafted it seems like the weapon's doing the

work not the biological entity yeah but if the chimp's stronger and faster and they can get to places where the accountant can't and they can charge into him in the middle of the night because they could see at nighttime there's a lot of things that you could do with chimps that were hybrids yeah like what did they what was the extent of that program let's find out

he the guy that did it was also then arrested i'm trying to figure out well like of course he was

arrested but he has a fucking psychopath well he was what's his name dr morrow ring a bell

it says he was funded by soviet authorities to set up experiments i'm like well were these private

you know or did well official i i would imagine if i was the leader of russia at the time and this guy said, Mr. Prime Minister, I have a program I am currently considering in operation where I will be able to make soldiers that are increasingly strong, much faster, that retain human characteristics, like the ability to communicate and to engage in warfare with weaponry. But they will be much faster, much stronger, and more importantly, not people. We won't mourn for them like our brothers and sisters. We will breed them in laboratories. We will make millions of them, arm them, and send them out against our enemies. Are you coming on to me? A little bit. I got hard talking about that. Wow.

So he successfully did a bunch of stuff in the early 1900s. What? Successfully. Not any human hybrids, but other animals. So they say. He was a pioneer in artificial insemination as well.

He conducted experiments that involved artificially inseminating horses to create superior offspring for Imperial Russia, and this work earned him recognition from the Bolsheviks. Ivanov was not satisfied with merely enhancing a species, though. Hybridization became his obsession, and he was soon crossing zebras with donkeys, cows with bison, and several different species of rodents. Huh.

each other in 1910 he brashly declared he could see a human ape hybrid in the future isn't this gene splicing though have you ever heard of a liger but ligers are just hybrids it's just they breed with each other a male tiger and a female lion or the opposite i don't forget which one right but but the problem is the reason why ligers are so big it's i think it's the either the male tiger or the male lion whichever one it is the male has the gene um for that regulate size And when they have the hybrid that gene doesn't doesn't transfer huh, and so the lagers just keep growing They're huge fucking gigantic. I might have fucked that up But I don't think I did even off imported chimps to Russia Inseminating unpaid Soviet women with their sperm unpaid though none conceived because humans and chimp chromosomes are incompatible Interesting imagine you're a fucking Soviet lady and you're like what is this job? You'll light them with your legs open and you stick something inside of you and you get a loaf of bread We give you the abominable snowman in your womb. How much did they know about genes back then? Genes and chromosomes. So what year was this?

Did they when did they discover chromosome yesterday? We just they might not have even known helium was on earth

Right. That's right. That's right. Yeah, they thought helium was only in the sun. Wow. When did they discover chromosomes? Let's find that out. Let's take a guess. Harlan?

I'm going to say in the 40s.

I'm going to go a little later. I'm going to say 50s. Okay. I'm going to say 57. I'm going to say 42. I am purely guessing, though. Me too. I have no idea.

Yeah, what you mean by that is kind of, it's very vague, because they could have known about them, but to what detail and how many there were. Well, let's just put that in perspective. I did, but it's giving a vague answer. In the 1800s, they sort of knew about it, but to what detail isn't until the 1900s.

Okay, chromosomes were first observed as distinct structures in the cell nuclei in the 1800s. Well, that's pretty distinct. They're talking about it in the cell structure. So they must have been looking at them with microscopes. Once good light microscopes became available, so that's the 1800s, their role as carriers of hereditary information was not clarified until the early 1900s through work linking chromosomes to Mendel's law of inheritance.

It's 100 years of guessing, which imagine what we're guessing about now that we don't know about. It could have been completely wrong for 35 years and then sort of closed for 10 and wrong again for 20. And then it's like, oh, no, that's what it is.

Yeah. Wild, right? It's wild how long it took in comparison to today.

This goes back to AI, Joe, giving access to the average person to be able to dig into this stuff, because it might be the guy in aisle 12 at Home Depot who discovers some of these probing answers, you know? Yeah, definitely. That's what I love about it.

It might be like, you know, hitting a bong, sitting at home, talking to Chad GPT and going, bro, tell me how to make a human-monkey hybrid. Exactly. So this guy, so it was, and I pulled it back up again?

Yeah, I was reading about him. This started to say the American backers started sending him some money, too. Of course.

They want to get those fucking crazy chimp people, too.

Call me crazy, but I get the feeling you would like to see one of those. 100%. Because physically it would have to look incredible.

It would be insane. Imagine if you get a Viking, like a Brock Lesnar gene, and you splice it with a chimpanzee gene. You have a giant, like Thor from Game of Thrones, the mountain from Game of Thrones. Imagine that guy splicing that guy's genes with a chimpanzee's genes.

Well, you keep going to chimp, but what about a silverback gorilla, which is even bigger? They're not as violent. Yeah, they're very calm, actually. They eat vegetables. They're vegans. Whereas chimps are pack hunters. They eat other monkeys.

Yeah, they're way more violent. They're way more like us. We're way closer to chimps than we are to gorillas. Yeah, we are. Yeah, we're closer in our behavior. They engage in war. They have tribal war. They go after tribes. They break off and start new civilizations.

But if you're splicing two entities together, you've got the human brain that's, you know, we're sort of wired to be violent. But you just take the physicality of the silverback and marry them together. They're just as wired to be violent as we are, buddy. What? Chimps? No, I'm saying the silverback. Then you have a bigger physical body with our minds.

But maybe they'll just chill like the gorillas do.

They just go to Miami.

New delivery of chimps to a nursery in 1930, but in the light of the questionable ethics in zero.

progress, Ivanov was arrested and exiled to Kazakhstan where he died two years later. Some of the apes and monkeys that outlived him were launched into space with the Sputnik missions. You imagine you imagine you're an ape. First they make you fuck some lady and then they shoot you off into space. You were just eating bananas, having a good time in the jungle being a regular chimpanzee and these motherfuckers make you fuck some janitor and then shoot you into space A janitor?

He successfully implanted an ovary in a few of them.

Oh, God. Wow. Fucking psychos. Jesus Christ.

Yeah, they've done over the course of history, the Germans, the Japanese, the Chinese, in times of war, they did the most horrific experimentation. They did everything you could do. They'd see how long it would take for a human body to die if you boiled it and skin people. And the things that have been done, the aberrations that have happened are crazy. But this is interesting. This is almost the basis for a movie, I think.

Well, it could absolutely happen today. This is where it gets weird. Because now with CRISPR and with gene editing, how many years are we away from them being actually able to do that? They're actually able to take whatever genes you have in a person, whatever genes you have in a chimpanzee, pick which ones, which things you want to do, and make a life form. I like it. You know, they have the dire wolves now, right? Yeah, the dire wolves. I saw them. I went to visit them.

You did. Are they pure? Are they 100% pure? Are they a version of a modern-day wolf mixed with a dire wolf? It's a really good question.

So that is the question that people always use to dismiss, or that is the statement that people use to dismiss what they've done as actually creating direwolves. But when I talked to the woman who's the head geneticist, the way she said it is these distinctions, like what we call something a direwolf or we call something a pug, whatever these distinctions are, these are our creations. And that the genetics are the same. Like, this animal looks like a dire wolf because it is a dire wolf. Okay. And some of those genes are in wolves. Some of those genes are in the biological tissue that they got from, like, thousand-year-old. Like, how old was the tissue that they got from a dire wolf that they used for colossal? I feel like some of it was, like, 10,000 years old, like something crazy.

Where did they find that tissue? What country?

They find it in America. You get it in, like, when they find fossils, or they find, like, a dead animal. They find something that they can get out of it where they can get some DNA. Yeah. And they've managed to get the actual DNA of a dire wolf. Beautiful. So 13,000 years old, a tooth from Sheridan Pitt, Ohio, and a 72,000-year-old skull from American Falls, Idaho. Wow. So they get the genes. They make a map. I'm butchering this. I'm sorry if you're a scientist. I'm sorry to all the people at Colossal. Yeah. You make a map of what it means to be a direwolf based on this stuff because you have these samples. And then you choose those genes. You add those genes to a gray wolf. And then you turn it into a fucking direwolf. And they're all white. And they have a mane like a lion, which they didn't know they were going to have. Like not as big as a lion, but it's a pronounced mane. Huh. And they look different, man. They're weird. Are they bigger in size because they were semi-prehistoric? They're bigger. It's a bigger animal. Bigger than a timber wolf? Yes. Wow. Yes. Yeah, they're like a 200-pound wolf, and they're built different. They're built different. They're more stocky, and they look different. What's their jaw structure like? Is it different? Bigger, bigger, stronger. It's a bigger, more ferocious animal that lived at a time where it was-

What does the term dire mean? Do we know? Dire wolf. That's a good question. What is dire?

Let's find out why they call them dire wolves. Yeah. I have no idea. It just sounds dope.

I wonder if they ever get sick if they become diarrhea wolves.

Is that where you go with that?

No, I really do want to know. That just came to me. That just came to me. But I do want to know where dire comes from, what it means.

Fearful or terrible. The Latin word is dirus, meaning fearful or terrible or awe-inspiringly dreadful. Bro, back then when those things were around and people were around at the same time, you imagine how fucking rough it would be here in the woods and you're camping out with your buddy and you see a pack of dire wolves that have recognized you and you know it's over?

Well, the thing with wolves, though, Joe, and you probably know this, wolves traditionally don't hunt down humans. That's not true. Huh?

That's not true at all.

I don't know. Is there any record of a human being killed by a wolf? 100%. There's a record in modern times.

Oh, and that's not true. That's the reason why they eradicated them from the West Coast.

I thought that was because they were nabbing the cattle.

No, they were killing people, too. That's what the big bad wolf in the Little Red Biding Hood is all about. They would kill your kids. Those stories were about avoiding wolves. wolves because wolves were dangerous they're deadly do you know that world war one the russians and the germans had a ceasefire because so many of them were getting killed by wolves in siberia really that they decided to have a ceasefire kill the wolves and then go back to killing each other

because my experience is wolves are very trepidatious of humans they fear them and because we killed most of them but that wouldn't change their hunting instinct now if there were still packs roaming wild and free if you don't kill the instinct out of them because then you'd kill their instinct to kill an elk or if you've seen wolves you've seen wolves in canada yeah

they hunt them in canada yeah yeah that's why they're trepidatious that's why they're nervous

about people can we look up how many humans have been killed by wolves very rare mostly happened

in europe and asia yeah see it's not common it's because we killed them all harlan they're not around anymore that's the whole point the reason why they got killed off was because they were a fucking problem it's not because you know people are evil and it was a terrible idea it's because they wanted to live and they knew that the wolves were fucking killing everybody i think the problem

was they were killing their domestic cattle 100 but not the people so much people too really yeah they kill they don't have rules man they're predators they're also think of it every living species why is it i can go to a park and a blue jay and a squirrel and a deer and a bunny can be just fine completely different species but then a little boy walks up a human and they all just go there's this driven instinct in all animals to fear us which breaks my heart because most of us are loving and want to coddle and connect with animals but even insects dragonflies hummingbirds Nothing wants to be near us. And so wolves also, all animals are trepidatious of humans. It's sad, but it's true. And if that's part of the bigger program we've been talking about, what does it say about us?

First of all, animals are not trepidatious of humans. Have you ever walked up to a wild animal? I've walked up to a lot of wild animals. I know that you're being silly. I'm not being silly. Okay, so realistically, all those animals you said, blue jay, deer, Those are all animals that eat plants, okay? If a dog showed up, they would run. Any animal that's a predator is going to scare them. Whether it's a human, we have eyes in front of our face. The reason why you have eyes in front of your face like that is because you're looking to go after something. When you have eyes on the side of your face, you're looking for something to go after you. So all those animals, like deer and all these cute little animals, they're all prey. And they're all super sketchy. With anything that has eyes in front of its face, it's looking at them. Because we are a fucking predator. But it would be the same if it was a coyote there. It would be the same if a dog was there. If a cat or a big cat or a lion was there, if they saw it, they would all freak out because they're prey. Now, wolves have killed people. Fact. 100% all throughout time. I'm just saying it's not. If they catch you alone, they catch you in the woods. And if it's you and five of them, they will kill you.

it's it's it's we're not on their dietary list though look at killer whales because you're not in their area killed by a killer whale only at sea world right because they well that's different so why that's a living mammal yeah but and there's millions of people in the ocean every day but there's no record of an orca killing a human no because they're trepidatious of us no they're

super intelligent and wolves and coyotes they're not trepidatious of it they help us they communicate

I know, but I'm just saying it's not common for wolves and apex predators to go after humans. It happens, but it's not common. And wolves, they're very skittish animals.

Okay, they're skittish if they're around people and they think the people might have a gun. If you're in the woods, wolves are not skittish of you. They're thinking about what they're going to do to you and whether or not they're going to eat you. If you have a rifle and you're in the woods and they hear the boom go off, they're going to get the fuck away from you. They don't know what a rifle is.

I'm just saying there's an instinctual fear of humans for whatever reason. Dude, it's not true. Most critters avoid us. Even fish if you walk off on them.

Critters avoid all predators. All of them.

Yeah, but look at the plains of Africa. You'll see a wildebeest and a zebra and a gazelle and a springbok.

Do you know what the fuck would happen to you if you walked out in the wild of Africa? You're done.

yeah yeah because you have lions and leopards you're prey there right all those animals are

freaking out too until one gets taken out right this is the joseph campbell story of the hero like one gets taken out the other one's going wow he did it for us because when that the lions are eating that one antelope they're going to leave you alone you can relax for a little bit yeah that's what it is i'm just They're never calm around lions. They run. That's why they run.

Right. But I'm just saying wolves are probably more inclined to step around us than attack us.

They are more inclined to do whatever they need to do to survive. They will. They're opportunists. And if it's attacking your sheep, then they'll attack your sheep. Right. If it's killing your dog, they'll kill your dog. If it's killing you, if you're 20 miles into the backcountry and you're camping alone and you don't have a weapon and a pack of wolves shows up and they haven't had anything to eat for a few days.

They'll take you down.

They'll take you down.

But I'm just saying, I'm just trying to instill into you with all this programming talk, there's something programmed into all the other species on this planet. They go, whoa, there's a fucking human. You're wrong. And they step around us a lot. No, you're wrong.

Not that they won't do or kill us, but... It's anything that's coming near them they get away from. Right. The reason why they're scared of people is because they have experience with people. Do they? Yes, wolves do. Wolves in Canada that get shot at are afraid of people. They know that people have the gun, the guns make the boom, they're smart. A bunch of them die, they see one of them die, they learn that, they see the gun, they see the stick, they run away from the guys. So they stay away from people because people might kill their family members, their PAC members. It happens. I think we're splitting hairs on this one. No, listen, there's a difference between the way bears react in, say, Alaska, than bears react in Montana. So in Montana, you can't hunt grizzly bears. So grizzly bears are not afraid of people because generation after generation after generation have not been hunted. When bears see you in Alaska, that's generation after generation that have been hunted, and they react very differently. They're like, get the fuck away from the people. Unless they don't know you have a gun and sometimes you have to scare them off. But if they're used to being around people with guns, they associate people with danger.

Yeah, that's kind of Pavlovian, though.

Right, but when they're not, like in Montana—

But in raw, wild, bears are quite skittish. I've been around them.

I have, too, man. It depends on the bear. It depends on whether it's a mother with her cubs. They're not skittish at all.

They're not skittish.

They'll fuck you up.

They're protective. They're no longer hunting. But I'm just saying that there's an element to, sadly, our human existence that scares a lot of critters. Most animals can exist together in the same area. And, yeah, when an apex predator approaches, the zebras will run. But if you look at the hoofed animals and the hippos and everything kind of coexists. But when a human walks in, you know, we can't walk up to critters and just pet them. You can in the Galapagos.

Okay.

Are we? No. Are we having a fight? No, but a lion can't walk up to a gazelle and pet him either.

I'll wrap my legs around you so fast. It's not uniquely humans, man. It's all animals are worried about something that wants to eat them. Right. Because that's a real part of their existence. Right. It's all animals. If you let your dog loose and you let it around wild animals, they fucking run like crazy, man. They run way more than they do with a person.

Let me rephrase it. If a wild animal comes up on a deer, a predator-prey scenario, instinctually they know a predator goes into stalking mode, the deer's gone. Right. But if a human, me or you, go, oh, look at the deer, and we try to walk towards it with nothing but love and affection, and we just want to pet it, and it's gone. And that's what I'm saying.

You're not saying shit. Because a dog, the same thing would happen. You're not making any sense. Yes. Of course the deer doesn't want you to pet them. It doesn't fucking know you, man. What are you, nuts?

Right, but they just flee. They don't flee like they do with dogs. Everything flees. A squirrel?

I have deer in my neighborhood, and when they see me, they don't give a fuck. They don't care about your car. You're driving in a car. You could stop the car and roll the window down and go, hello, Mr. Deer, and they just fucking stare at you.

All animals are like that.

If they saw a dog, they would fucking run. They'd run like crazy. Even my golden retriever, my sweet golden retriever, Marshall. Yeah. They'd run like crazy from him. They'd blow. They'd make those crazy noises. Yeah. And they'd fucking take off. They'd stamp their feet. Yeah, they're scared of predators, dude. They're not scared of people in my neighborhood because no one's eating them in my neighborhood. It's their conditioning.

I don't know. I'm just talking about... You're stuck on an idea.

People are bad. People are uniquely bad. I wish we could just go hug the porcupine.

No, I'm not saying people are bad. I'm saying that animals have something in their brain that they don't trust us.

Because we're the apex. We're the top of the food chain. But it's just sad that... It's not. It's way better than being at the bottom of the food chain. Way better than us like fucking wondering through the woods if your kids are gonna get eaten by a fucking wolf Because some grainy dipshit decided and poured them back into the wild. We need to rewild all the wolves. Wait, you don't like that wolves are back in the wild? You know they just dropped them off in Aspen? These dumb motherfuckers. You don't like it? They dropped them off on a cattle ranch, and all they're doing is eating cows. Eating the cows. So now they have to have cowboys 24-7 riding horses because the governor's husband thought it would be a cute idea to drop off wolves in Colorado. And they reintroduced him to an area that has agriculture. They reintroduced him to ranching areas. Wow. Five fucking wolves. They've killed who knows how many cows. The government has to reimburse them every time a cow dies. They keep killing cows. They're not allowed to kill the wolves. The wolves are around them 24 hours a day just circling. So they have cowboys on horses all throughout the night. They've got fires.

They have to keep people employed. But outside of the cattle poaching critters, are you for reintroducing and repopulating areas of the—

First of all, wolves were making their way into Colorado naturally. They're already in the San Juan Mountains. They're moving in from Wyoming, where they live naturally. And when they reintroduced them into Montana, those have spread out all over the place. There's plenty of fucking wolves, man.

But aren't there plenty of fucking cows, too? You don't like wolves.

I don't think you want wolves. I don't think you understand what you're saying. You're talking about a pack predator. It's very different than any other predator. They work together in coordination, and they're smart. And it's not like a mountain lion. It's not like a thing that acts alone. Once they figure out that the cows are in these wooden pens and they could just hop the pen, kill a cow, and that's it, they're going to do it forever.

Right. Forever. But take out the poaching wolves, but the ones that are reintroduced and assimilate in raw nature. I think those are crucial and important to that ecosystem.

It is crucial to have balance. And there's some aspects of having the wolves back in Montana that's actually better for the elk population. It is. Because the elk population was very overpopulated at one point in time. They had seasons where they were allowing people to shoot them in the snow in the winter. So, like, there were so many of them. When they're in the snow, like deep snow, they can't run. So you basically—

The wolves.

No. The elk. Elk. Because before they reintroduced the wolves, they had so many elk. Yeah. These elves were running out of resources. Yeah. And they realize, like, they're so overpopulated, we're going to allow you to shoot them in ways that's not even remotely sporting. They're stuck in snow. It's called culling. Yeah. You're just taking as many out of the population as you can. And look, for the people that live there, it's amazing. You're eating elk 12 months out of the year. You've got a freezer. It's fucking delicious. How dare you?

No, I mean, if you eat it all the time. But don't forget the wolves also preserve the whole ecosystem because the overpopulation of elks were eating so much of the flora that the sides of riverbanks were eroding.

You're quoting a documentary called How Wolves Changed Rivers. Right. Yeah, widely disputed. So a lot of the stuff they're saying is not accurate in that documentary. What is accurate is that balance is important, but a lot of things are very overstated in that, and it turned out to not be true. No, a lot of the claims are not true. Interesting. You can have a pro, and the pro is it keeps the population in check and it puts a natural balance to the area. That's the pro. Yeah. This whole changing rivers thing, some of it's accurate, some of it's not. Yeah, but apparently that documentary was made by a guy who's into rewilding. I see. And he also wants to rewild Europe. So it's very romantic, this idea. Okay. But there is positive to having a balanced ecosystem. There is not positive when wolves get overpopulated. When wolves get overpopulated, that's what you get when you had Russia and Germany having a fucking ceasefire in World War I. Because they were losing so many soldiers to wolves. they all united together to kill the wolves that's a true story but do you ever live in a world where

you go the wolves are part of the natural world the same way the bison were on the great plains

before they eradicated you don't have kids no okay well i had billy imagine if you had kids and you were walking with your kids and you saw three wolves following you yeah and you didn't have a gun how would you feel about those wolves when you thought oh my god we might get taken out by wolves and i just thought they were these cute fuzzy things that were a part of nature

oh i don't think of them as that i don't think of them they're amazing we need them i worked in

nature i've been around wolves i know i am on team people you are 100 100 team people i love all animals i love them all yeah but i love people way more if it was between a person that i fucking hate that it feels a real piece of shit and i knew that they're going to get taken out by a wolf but i had a rifle i'd kill the fucking wolf 100 of the time because i'm on team people but this whole idea like the animals are scared of us good be scared it doesn't mean you should do anything bad to those animals but good good be scared but joe isn't trying to eat my kids isn't it team

people that's eradicating all the animals as we encroach deeper and deeper into the amazon jungle the African plains, we're losing – look at the American bison. There used to be millions of them herding across the prairies, and now there's isolated pockets. Right, but do you know how that happened? Look at the elephant herds. Look at the silverback gorilla. Look at – there's so many things that are losing to team people that we might not have Siberian tigers in 30 years.

I'm not saying you should go and kill these endangered animals.

I don't say they do.

I told you that we're not always. That's not true. First of all, the bison thing was not because of encroaching. The bison thing was because of sport hunting, where these people were like, they were doing it, not even sport hunting, market hunting. They were doing it for tongues. Do you know that's what they were getting? They were chopping out their tongues. All that delicious bison meat, they let it rot. Then they were doing it for furs, and then they were doing it for bones. like what this is is like people were fucking insane and rifles were fairly new and long-range rifles are fairly new in human history right and all of a sudden you got people on trains and you've got just pop shooting them now here's where it gets really weird um what's dan's dan flores there's a guy named dan flores who wrote a book on bison and he has a theory it's a really good one. The reason why there were so many bison on the plains was because of all the Native Americans that got wiped out by disease. And it totally coincides with it. Because the original explorers that came to America in like the 1400s, they did not describe these enormous population of bison. We would see millions of them on a prairie. He thinks that that came about because literally when the europeans visited native america the native americans 90 of the native americans died because of disease right 90 i mean a true apocalypse yeah imagine nine out of ten native americans dead yeah because of disease well that means no one's hunting the bison right but so that was their that was a primary food source for a lot of the native americans And it wouldn't take many generations for them, if that was the thing that was keeping them in population, if they have a balanced ecosystem, and the population was literally being controlled by these effective North American hunters, and all of a sudden they're gone, the population just booms. And that's what he was saying. And then along comes the people with the rifles. And then the rebuild of the rifles, they're finding these sitting ducks just sitting out there, and they say, there's so many of them, we could just shoot as many as we want. We never have to worry about it. And they're shooting him for tongues.

Yeah.

Tongues.

Have you ever heard of Buffalo Head Smashed In?

Buffalo Head Smashed In?

Yeah.

What's that?

It's a town in Alberta.

That's the real name of the town?

It's the real name of the town where on the plains there, there was an optical illusion where it looked like the hills just kept going. but there was a cliff and the indians would chase the bison along the plains and they didn't know it and at the end they'd they'd all run over the thing and the indians would be waiting at the bottom and kill the bison but they named the place buffalo head smashed in oh wow look at this now wild wow so the bison thought they're running on a flat plane and they couldn't see the change in the perspective so they'd run right over the edge they did that a bunch of places in

north america in north america they did um there's one of them where they killed so many bison that the rotting of them yeah caused them to burst into flames yeah and so yeah you know about that

yeah that's like with whales when they blow up yeah they explode the whole side of the hill is

like black with coal oh yeah because they they've popped the imagine the fucking smell of something where it gets so bad they burst into flames bro what the instant bar texas barbecue so they the native americans when they were really good at hunting doing stuff like that i mean they're feasting they're eating the best meat and they're keeping the population in check now when they all died of disease that population stopped being in check and this is dan flores i think it's called see if you can find the name of it jimmy i think it's called bison diplomacy bison ecology i think that's what it's called nature also provides disease when there is no humans around okay like long before the indians started hunting buffalo there were buffalo yeah

bison ecology and bison diplomacy it's a very interesting paper he was a professor of history at texas tech um very very good book and and he's got another great book on coyotes coyote america

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If Team Human keeps pushing animals out of business, like at what point do we tip the scales? We're at, what, 7 billion now, humans? I think it's more. So at what point are you still a fan of Team Human when more and more of Team Animal is being eradicated? And I'm not trying to say we should hate humans.

What animals are being eradicated right now?

Well, I just explained how the herds of elephants have shrunk down to this. Tigers are down to a few thousand. And a lot of that is- Silverback gorillas are down to like a few hundred.

Okay. A lot of that is not encroaching. It's illegal poaching.

It's that, but it's also encroaching. We're using up their land. Some of it, but also- A lot of it.

It's like, what do you want those people to do? Like people in India, like where they have elephants just invade their farms and eat all their food.

But that's what I'm saying. How long are you a proponent of team human?

People have been in those villages for hundreds and hundreds of years. But animals have been for millions. I'm on team people. If it's your family that needs that farm to stay alive and all of a sudden a fucking pack of elephants comes in and eats all the food that you've been working for a year to plant and grow, what do you think? We should just feed the elephants and go to the grocery store?

I'd rather see the animals succeed than us, if I'm being honest. I love people. That is a ridiculous thing.

That's a ridiculous thing to say. It doesn't mean the animals are going to go extinct.

Don't you think we're a parasite on the back of Eden? Don't you think humans are a parasite on the back of this beautiful paradise? No. No animal dumps nuclear waste or chemicals into rivers. No animal tears down forests except for beavers. So what makes Team Human so great? I think you need to change your attitude, Joe Rogan.

We definitely shouldn't do those things. but I am a human and I like humans I love them, I love you and the only way that you're going to have humans is if you stay on team human and not say I'd rather have the animals here they're just going to eat you they're going to eat you and there'll be no more houses

but if you could press a button and get rid of humans with a press of a button and that everything else could just live here harmoniously, would you do it? what do you live in a fucking Disney movie? I'm just asking

no, no chance I live in a simulation of a Disney movie. Bro, you live in some bullshit Canadian reality show.

Oh, boy, he's taking another drink of coffee.

Son of a bitch. You soft fly over this table with my rotten legs. You're fucking Team Canada. I know what you're doing. I'm just asking you. You're trying to ruin America by bringing in wolves. That's what you're doing. No. He's like a plant. He's a plant. I'm asking you. You're trying to ruin America by bringing in lions and wolves. Do you think humans are a parasite on the planet? I think we are a very complicated and intelligent life force that values itself above all else to the detriment of the ecology of the earth itself. However, we could do better. We don't all do that. Every company is not dumping things into rivers. If you had a cancer on your body, would you get rid of the cancer? We're not a cancer, dude. We're a part of the earth. We are the predominant intelligent life force on this earth.

Who predominantly destroys the earth? Us.

cancer we're not destroying it though

we just do a bad job of keeping it clean that's a fancy way of saying destroying

most animals shit all over the ground

hit the button come on you want to do it together you should have kids I love kids I love humans I just wish we could do better better. How old are you now? Take a guess. Take a guess. You saw my legs. Take a guess.

I'll tell you. 35? No, I'll tell you. Well, I've known you for 30 years. Yeah. So you're

at least that. How old? You got to be 50-something. How old are you? I'll be 64 this year. Really?

Yeah. Wow. Yeah. But I love humans, but I also- If you had a kid now, it might be a problem. You might have bad jizz. Really? Yeah. You might have old jizz. Have you seen my legs?

I've seen the legs look good. What do you mean bad jizz? Old jizz. Al Pacino just had a kid and he's 400. Give that kid an IQ test. Really?

Is he a dementoid? I don't know. He's a baby. Maybe her strong genes because she's only 12. The girly... No. How old is she? No. She's just 30. Whatever she is. 30 years old. How old are you now?

kid with a 58 oh wow yeah we look pretty good with your chest and my legs we're doing all right right do you did you ever want to have kids at one point yeah you know i i thought that uh at one point i would i thought that at one point i might but it just didn't work out that i was i was married at one point and is it it's like it's hard when you're doing the road a lot it's hard It is if you make it hard, but I never did the road a lot. I always mixed it so that I enjoyed my life and traveled and did stuff.

That's smart.

Yeah.

That's smart.

But it just didn't work out. And who knows? The road ain't closed yet, so who knows? Get your jizz checked. Make sure it's good. Yeah. Oh, it's fine. Throw it into a spectrometer. Oh, my God. I just told you I was on OnlyFans for two hours.

Analyze the jizz. Make sure it's good stuff. Wait, can sperm actually go bad? Well, when it comes to autism and maybe even Down syndrome, there's some people that believe that the older the parents are. And they used to think that it was just the older the woman was that might contribute to those things. And now they think it is also likely the father. They're also realizing a lot of – there was this thing that I was reading about miscarriages from parents where the father drinks. And I was like, wow, that's interesting. because i never really thought that the father being a drunk would affect the sperm but of course

it would yeah of course it would yeah and weed too they used to say weed affected the sperm but i

don't know if that's well they used to say it slows it down or something like that i don't know what does adderall do speed it up i don't know oh zempic you give birth to a zombie you give birth to a fucking jazzed up adderall kid dad i want to fucking clean this house wait do you have any

boys or is it all girls all girls oh wow do you wish you had a boy i just want them to be healthy

yeah i think wishing that you had a boy or a girl it's like the universe will give you what it gives you yeah that's good yeah you don't want to like you don't want to wish you had a boy when you had

a girl just to appreciate the fact that you have a no i don't i don't mean eliminate the girls god bless the three girls but if you had one more would it be cool to have a boy i'm very happy oh good okay i don't think about it that way you're a good dad thank you that's something i

picked up on you today i think uh everybody should try yeah if you're a dad you got one shot at this one of the things that's really nice for me is that i don't have to travel as much because i have a club here yeah you know when they were young i had to travel a lot when they were really young because it's like okay i wasn't making as much money yeah it was like a little bit more difficult and having uh the club where i don't have to do stand-up somewhere else i don't have to go on the road all the time so i'm only going on the road occasionally for like the ufc and

Yeah, and you don't need to either. No, just having fun. So you're done good, guy. You too, buddy.

It's nice to see Kill Turney make a completely different career arc for all these people. Yeah. And you're one of them. It's fucking taking you to the stratosphere. It's wild to watch.

It's shone a new light on my career. Yeah, it's sort of revitalized it a bit.

You, Rob Schneider, Carrot Top. I mean, the list goes on and on. There's Kyle Dunnigan. There's so many people that it just fucking launched them.

It's so cool. When Tony asked me to do it two years ago, I'll be honest, I didn't even know what it was. That's hilarious. I didn't know who Tony was. I'd never met him. I knew nothing about it. I was doing your club, and they said, hey, we're shooting tomorrow. Would you want to stay an extra day? And I said, for what? They go, kill Tony. I said, what is it? And I went on. Really? I had no clue. I had no idea what it was.

Are you not online at all?

No, I didn't know anything about that stuff.

How do you stay offline?

Well, I go online now because I started a podcast. I'm trying to emulate you, but you've been an inspiration. Thank you, by the way. But I didn't know about all that stuff.

And so they asked me to go on, and I did my first set with Tony, and I think you watched it. It was the one where I had the checkbook. And then Tony, when they finished the show, he goes, oh, you're going to be guest of the year. I go, what are you talking about? And then I was guest of the year, and then it just sort of all this stuff. And now I'm about to shoot a movie with Tony as my star. I'm going to direct a movie with them.

Was it Madison Square Garden where you were pulling the things out of your pants?

Yeah, the limes. I said I had Lyme disease, and I pulled the Lyme's out.

What if you pull a trophy out of your pants?

Yeah, an Oscar. That's when I won Guest of the Year. I love to pull stuff out of my pants, apparently. What is the movie you and Tony are doing? So my next movie that I'm writing and directing is called Rednecks, and we're going to shoot in September, October with Tony as the star. And I don't know if you'd do any acting anymore, but I want to offer you a part. I don't know if you're interested. Yeah, you don't like it, huh? I don't really act anymore.

No. You got no interest anymore? Maybe if I could kill it for a day. Just run in and do it in a day. Really? Yeah. Something easy.

Be fun to have you. Where are you going to film it? We're going to shoot in Florida and Kentucky. Jesus. What if I got you for three days? Would you do it?

What do I have to do? We'll talk. Let's talk afterwards. Okay. I really don't like acting. I know. I don't have any time either. That's also part of the problem.

like time is uh my time is rationed i get it yeah yeah do you still have the passion to act at all

or no is it yeah i never really had in the beginning yeah i only did it for money yeah like uh i loved stand-up and i loved you know going to clubs and doing and then i got a development deal it was that simple yeah and all of a sudden i'm on tv i'm like all right but it was good that i never had a dream for it because then it i didn't have a lot of anxiety about it yeah you know it was more like it was fun to do yeah me too because i was always like i'm just gonna go do stand-up like this yeah it was the same way yeah it's better that way because the people that like where it's there oh my god it's happening it's like so overwhelming for them like i see people have anxiety when they're about to do their scenes and i was like jesus man chill out well we we're so used to performing in front of audiences yeah that for some people the the moment like for young actors the moment when it's like action and you walk in and then you see that crowd it's overwhelming for some people yeah it is it's very hard for them to find that comfort level that allows them to perform at the level that they know they can yeah like they might be really good actors but the feeling is so overwhelming they can't find the rhythm you know what the opposite

of that was for me and i don't know if you had this experience we were used to performing in front of live audiences doing stand-up where they're like reacting immediately we do a joke they laugh but now when you're doing a movie or tv suddenly you're in front of an audience who are cameraman and directors and make and they just stand there they don't laugh right and that became like the opposite of what we do so when i first started doing tv and movies i'd get anxiety because it's like well they're not laughing they're not reacting they're just standing there It was all these technical people, and that freaked me out a little bit, but I had to overcome that.

Yeah, that is weird. If you think it's really funny, and then you're saying it, and no one's laughing.

Yeah, they're all just standing, because they're just making a movie.

Right, because it's not like the cameras are there by themselves. There's people behind the cameras, and you're doing it for people.

A whole crew, like 50 people would be standing there while you're doing a scene.

With a cigarette in their hand, drinking coffee, shaking their head.

Checking notes. Did that throw you when you first started?

Well, news radio luckily was in front of an audience. Yeah, that's true.

But they were between the audience and you was all those people and cameras.

Yeah, but the people laughed at all the jokes. Okay, good. If they were good, if they were good jokes. So that was to me was like a different way of delivering jokes. It was still, it was fun. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed sitcom, but the only way to do it right is to have really good writers. and that's hard to find man like news radio had that and really good performers but if you're on a bad one you're in hell you're in hell and you're just collecting checks yeah and you just good checks though good check that's the problem yeah that's the problem the velvet prison yeah those are the guys that wind up doing drugs the guys that are on a show that they hate yeah they yeah you go straight two and a half men so fucking charlie sheen in it oh yeah it's part of it and Part of it is just, like, you're in that lifestyle anyway. Yeah, you're wired. But part of it is also, like, I don't want to do this. Yeah. You know?

Yeah, I experienced that.

I don't want to do a sitcom. I'm bored. I'm bored with these lame punchlines. And next thing you know, you're smoking crack and running from the cops.

You know what I realized, too? is with these sitcoms it's they all keep borrowing the same premise like i did three different sitcoms and it's like oh now we're doing the episode where uh the lead guy is somehow dating an snm queen and now we're doing the episode where uh jim gets his car stolen like you start to realize like there's about 40 different episodes but they all just insert them and sort of change them a little and it's really very weird yeah it's like a recipe so many premises yeah right

yeah it's well that's just the uncreative ones i mean that's why curb your enthusiasm was so amazing yeah yeah they didn't repeat any that's right that's right was fucking incredibly creative

and bizarre and no audience that's right another one no audience yeah but the ones the ones that that were fresh were the ones that didn't it was more like the traditional sitcoms that just plugged in the premises and was like it's like oh my god i've already done this there's but there's

something to that form where it's when it's done really well it is very enjoyable it's very comforting like i i always thought like i saw clips of the big bang i never watched the big bang yeah until i started watching with my kids and i'm like this is a fucking very funny show it's like a really good show with like very defined characters really well made and i had this uh prejudice of it i think because i had seen some clips where they were doing like retakes and there's no audience so they're saying the jokes with no laughs behind them it just seems kind of lame but everything seems lame like that like retakes of news radio seemed lame too while we were doing them yeah but when i watched the show i was like there's something comforting about this kind of a show and i wish they still did them they don't do them anymore yeah they're dying Miss Pat is the only one that I know of that has an actual sitcom right now. Like a 3KM? She's got a live audience sitcom. Wow, yeah. I don't think anybody else does. Or if they do, I don't know about it. They used to be fucking common as shit, man. Yeah, that was the goal.

That was the dream, to go get a sitcom. But isn't it weird that we still enjoy them, but yet no one makes them anymore? Yeah. I think they've been knocked out of contention because they're so set up. Whereas we live in this world now where people just scroll real life. But why?

Because dramas are still on TV. There's still a million NCSI, whatever the fuck those shows are. You know what I mean? There's a million of those shows. That's the Hulk one said. Law and Order, Special Victims Unit. There's a million of those shows. So those kinds of same premise shows of cops and lawyers and all that shit, those still exist. The medical examiner shows, the forensic examiner shows. those shows exist so how come all these you know there's yeah a resurgence of rancher shows now everyone's a rancher right this is 15 rancher shows now so those shows exist yeah no sitcoms

as the incredible hunk hulk once said me not know why i think it's a giant mistake because i think

you could make a sitcom right now whether paramount plus does it or one of those organizations that streams you could make a great fucking multi-cam sitcom right now yeah i don't even

turn on the tv anymore though i think people are being weaned right off of television we're in a transitional phase i think you don't watch netflix dude i rarely ever when i used to go on the road i would check into a hotel and turn on the tv right away i don't think i've turned on a hotel tv in about six years really i don't even turn it on when i go home i watch my tv maybe once a month if that i don't even look at it anymore so do you look at your phone i look at my phone that's it that's it it's bizarre i'm even weirded out by it it's like what am i doing you never sit down

and watch a movie rarely it's very rare you should do that you should watch a movie i know

They're very entertaining. People should watch my new movie. Can I say something about it?

You don't watch movies and you make them?

Yeah.

You know how fucking crazy that is?

Yeah.

What's wrong with you?

I'm crazy. I'm crazy, all right. What is your new movie? Do you mind me talking about it? Please do. Are you sure? 100%. I wrote, directed, and starred in a new movie that just came out a few days ago called Wingman. And it's on streamers, Apple TV, and it's on Prime, Prime Video. And I play a crazy wingman that helps people get laid. Nice. Yeah. And it's with Jamie Kennedy, Russell Peters, Kayla Wallace, Evan Marsh. Oh, nice. Shiva Nagar. Did you make this yourself? Well, we made it with a studio, Stardust Pictures, up in Canada with David Lipper and Justin Levine. It's a full-on movie we shot up in Canada.

Nice.

Yeah, really proud of it, and I hope people check it out. I hope you check it out.

I'll check it out if you promise to watch movies every now and then yourself.

I'll do it if you promise to be in my next movie, and we'll watch it together. That's a lot. It's an offer. Okay. We can talk. Okay. I'm excited. I'd love to see you get back in to do a little acting.

I like that there are comedy movies again. I really do. Yeah. That's nice.

Well, that's the one with I'm going to do with Tony is full on. That's why I'm sort of asking you, because I want to see you get your comedy face in there again. What is it about? It's about a redneck culture. And this is the part where you really love it, because I know you love vehicles. It centers around something called a mud bog, where guys in Florida jack up their pickup trucks and drive through mud for three days. It's not monster trucks. They just drive through mud and jump and spray. and then the other part of the movie takes place in those airboats that drive through all the marshes in Florida and you would be the mayor of this town and get into it with Tony who becomes one of these mug bod guys so you'd be around all this shit

good lord Florida is a different part isn't it wild look at these fucking cars that's crazy you got an old Camaro

tell me you wouldn't like to be around

that Joe scroll back up please it's so fun digging into the world of mud bogging in north central florida yeah so tony's gonna be the uh

the lead guy who tries to win the whole mud bog thing but meanwhile the mayor which would be you wants him out of town because he's such a redneck he doesn't like the culture oh jesus Yeah, look at that. Florida is so different. It is such a different place. Yeah.

God.

So we're going to have fun doing that. But yeah, thank you for letting me mention Wingman. No, that's awesome, dude. It's when you do an indie project, it helps to be able to talk about it. So thank you.

If you got an offer after this show to do a sitcom, would you consider doing it? And if someone said, listen, I think we could bring back the multicam sitcom.

but we want you to star in it harlan i would if it was if it's all about the material yeah because me and you were older i think as we get older it becomes about how do we want to dedicate our time i'm not interested in just doing oh i got a sitcom it's got to have meaning to me of course it's got

to be something where i think you could help create it oh yeah that's what i'm saying like all those guys that used to work work on all those shows like seinfeld and friends and they they have to still be out there in the world oh yeah isn't that nuts yeah like you imagine imagine back in the 90s when everybody wanted a sitcom when we were first coming up if you said you know one day there'll be no more sitcoms you'd be like what the fuck are you talking about you would have never believed that if you went into these rooms where they're making sex in the city and the single guy and all these rooms hey guys enjoy it while you can yeah because in a couple of decades there's gonna be zero sitcoms on television they would have just laughed yeah they would have kicked you out of that off get the fuck out of here you don't know what you're

talking about meanwhile that's true well this is why i love i hate i'm just gonna go back to quickly ai because it shows we're evolving you know remember joe at one point movies were black and white they didn't have sound really yeah yeah they were they and then talkies came and color and digital and so i love it that every form of our entertainment is evolving and becoming there's stuff gonna come that we don't even know which i love me too yeah but i think sitcoms didn't have to go away that's what i'm saying yeah maybe not but maybe so like the new wait like your daughters probably don't want to sit down for half an hour they love sitcoms they do

they watch old ones okay well i was wrong i was really wrong well i'm hurting me and my youngest We sat through the entire season, I mean, the entire all seasons of Big Bang Theory. That was me and my family. We watched that one. Yeah. My wife and my... And then we watched Young Sheldon, which was the next version of it. Young Sheldon was really good. It was a single cam show that was on Netflix, and it was Sheldon as a young kid. It was the genius kid as a young boy. Very funny show, but totally different. like really cute sweet show but not uh in front of a live audience and i think there's something i loved doing news radio i really did yeah and but it was just because it was insanely talented cast and we were all like brothers and sisters we were we had so much fun family for five years we worked together we got drunk all the time and we it was so silly yeah it was such a fun set

It's like summer camp.

Yeah, it was really fun.

And the show, I think, was really good. Yeah, it did well. And also, here's the best part, it was never really successful, which was great. Because none of us got really rich or famous from that show. It was always like not doing so well in the ratings. We got moved nine times in five years. And this was back before the internet. So you couldn't send out a tweet, hey, we're on Sunday nights now. Wow. And it was back also when nobody had Tebow.

I just saw this trailer the other day. This is a spinoff from Big Bang Theory, but it's not a, it's like, you know, in front of an audience sitcom, and it's not multicam either, I suppose, but it was popping up.

Oh, no shit.

Yeah. It's called, bruh, Stuart Fails to Save the Universe. Huh? But it's a new show, you know? Okay. It is a comedy. It is a 30-minute show, kind of.

So it's in that universe. Yeah, yeah.

Even, like, the logo is, like, got the same kind of.

Wow. It's on HBO. Yeah. Nice. Wild. Yeah. Huh. Who's created more bangers than that Chuck Lorre guy? Oh, my God, yeah. That guy's created so many big sitcoms. He did. He was big bang. What's that?

An article he wrote, or I just read interviewing him, said that those shows kind of died because The Office and Curb kind of killed it for a while. Interesting. The single camera stuff. Yeah, the single camera, no audience. Yeah. I was also thinking I wouldn't want to go sit and watch a taping of a show right now. How much would they have to pay an audience to do that?

Right. Well, you only have to pay the audience until the show becomes successful. True. Yeah, I guess people would want to go. Yeah. You don't really want a paid audience because they're not as much fun. Like news radio in the beginning, nobody knew who the fuck we were. But by season three, the audience was news radio fans. Yeah. And it became a totally different thing. It was really fun. And Phil Hartman used to do stand-up. Oh, nice. He had talked about doing stand-up in the clubs, but he was really good at impressions. He would do Bill Clinton impressions. He had bits. He had little things he would run, and he would just do it for fun. And, you know, we talked about him actually doing it in clubs, and he thought about doing it. But it was the whole thing was silly. Like Andy Dick would address the audience. People would answer questions. We had a good warm-up guy. It was like a party that was going on. Everybody had a great time. And that was after the show, you know, caught its gear. But it never was popular until it became syndicated. Then it was the syndication. Then it became really popular.

At least yours was sort of popular. Every week they'd put out the top 100, and my sitcom was always number 99 or 100. So at least yours was probably up in the top 30.

No. One day, Lou Morton was one of our writers, and Lou every week would show up with a T-shirt with a number on it that he would draw with magic marker of what we were. And one day he showed up and it said 88. I go, 88? He goes, yep. I go, no. He goes, yeah. I go, fuck.

Dude, I was 100 every week.

Well, what network were you on? The WB. We were on NBC.

Yeah, okay. So WB didn't have affiliates all across the country. We only had like 60%. 88 at NBC is you're barely alive. But still, 100 hurts. 100.

Well, they always tell us, don't worry. We're not worried about the numbers. We know you've got to find your audience again. Now you're on Monday night. You used to be on Sunday. Oh, man. And one time we were on Thursday night, we were in the Friends Sandwich. So it was Friends and Seinfeld, which Paul Sims, the executive producer of NewsRadio, famous called the Shit Sandwich. Because in between Friends and Seinfeld, you would have like Caroline and the City and these shows that weren't as good.

Do you want to hear about Salt in the Wound?

Yeah.

So mine was show was number 100. Okay. It was called Simon. It was me. I was the star. I played Simon. Jason Bateman played my brother.

Look at that.

And the lead girl, Andrea Benderwald, we ended up dating. She became my girlfriend. Her best friend was Jennifer Aniston. She lived with Jennifer. So I would go and stay at Jennifer's house every night with my girlfriend. We were like three's company. And I'd have to sit there and watch Friends with Jennifer, the number one show. well me and andrea were at the bottom at number 100 it was like oh i mean love jennifer was so happy but talk about salt in the wound it was like oh damn isn't it crazy though but you're

on tv you're living the dream this is one oh it was great it was great the earliest social media was the the variety magazine and the hollywood report yeah that was like the same thing where These people would compare themselves to everybody else. And they would look at the rankings. And I would show up on the set. And, you know, like, all these people loved to read those things. And they were reading those things. And I started calling them the devil's rag. I go, why are you reading the devil's rag? I go, because we were complaining.

I can't believe we're number 36. If we were on Thursday night, we would be number two or number one or whatever. And I go, last time I checked, I'm on TV. I go, we're on TV. We're on TV on NBC. There's not a lot of people that get to be on TV. This is great. We're living the dream. So we're not number one. You guys are reading that, and you're forgetting how many people that you're friends with that are going on auditions right now that would kill to be on NBC. But it's the devil's rag. It's the same thing that happens with, you know, you say, oh, I just got a new car. I'm pretty happy. And then, oh, Jeff Bezos got a yacht. Fuck.

I'll be honest. I was like you. I was like, I'm on TV. But I got to tell you, as we got deeper into the season, and I had to sit there beside Jennifer Aniston and watch her number one show every week, and old 100 is sitting beside her. I got to say, it started to seep in where you're just like, fuck, I'm on TV. You know, it's sort of like there were days when it was just you could feel it. Not blaming her, but just the business. It was hard to sit at one end and see the other. But that's the way it works. It's the way it is. But you got to really just be happy. Oh, it's great. You're winning the lottery.

Yeah, you won the lottery. You just didn't win the mega Powerball.

Yeah, and I loved it. I got to work with Jason and I, you know, I was the star of my, I came from the suburbs of Toronto. Never thought I'd do anything. Here I am. I got this. I'm the star of my own sitcom, Simon. I'm like, this is unbelievable. Yeah. I share your attitude. Yeah.

Yeah. And there's a lot of them that don't work, man. Yeah. I was on the set and we were there. Like, so you'd go to the Sunset Gower and there'd be a bunch of other places that were next to you. Yeah. And I'd go visit with all those guys, because a lot of them were my friends. Lenny Clark. Lenny Clark was right down the street, because he was on the John Larroquette show. Do you remember that?

Yeah, I got a little story about that when you're done. Please, go ahead. Tell me. Are you sure? You don't want to finish? Did John Larroquette yell at you? So before I got my own sitcom, so I was in Hollywood. I did two auditions. I did one for Ellen DeGeneres' first show. It was called These Friends of Mine. And I was a guest star on the show with Molly Shannon. and then my second audition was for the John Larroquette show and I went in and auditioned and the feedback to my agents was John said, this guy wants his own sitcom and I said to my agents, I said, you're damn right I do and the next gig I got was my own sitcom so I was like, Chick-Chan is pretty cool

so you think he didn't like you because you wanted your own sitcom or he thought you were too good for his show because you want your own sitcom

I think he must have sensed I walked in there with attitude or cockiness, which I didn't. I just did the audition, but he must have been reading my vibe somehow.

Well, that's you.

Yeah.

That's how you walk. People that don't, you know, you, this, Harlan, you've always been like this. I have. From the moment I met you. Yeah. You've always been like this very happy, very confident guy. You never look rattled to do a show. You always look like you're having a good fucking time. Oh, yeah. All of us, like, there was moments where everyone had a big show and you're like, fuck, real nervous. You were never like that. You were always, like, happy-go-lucky. Yeah. I don't know one person that doesn't like you.

Oh, wow. Do you know how crazy that is? No, I'm not even married.

But do you know how crazy that is? Like, I know every comic that I know has a comic that they don't get along with, that they hate. Yeah. Someone hates them or they hate them or there's some fucking, fuck that guy, that guy's a piece of shit. His comedy sucks. No one says that about you. Do you know how amazing that is? That's a blessing. We were talking about that in the green room one day. We were talking about it in the green room because it was after you came on with Dimitri. I told everybody I was howling. He waited the whole show before he pulled his fucking snake out of his pants. By the way, that snake sat right in front of Donald Trump when he was here. I loved it. I told you that. I know you did. So that conversation that we had in the green room was like, who the fuck do you know that doesn't like Harlan? And we all sat around and talked about it. There's no one. Aw. You are like the most universally loved comedian that I know. Oh, my gosh. I have to defend Tony to everybody.

Yeah, Tony, yeah.

I have to go, he's a great guy. Yeah. He's a great guy. He is, yeah. It's just like in that world, you have to understand the roast world. Like, that is not the real world, kids. That is, you're going for blood. Yeah. Like, if you're in a cage fight and you elbow someone in the face, it's not because you're a bad person. You have to. It's like, that is the game. That's your job. That's the game we're playing.

If you don't do it, you're letting yourself down. You've got to go in and fight.

That's the game we're playing. These are the rules that we're under. We're all talking shit. And so when you see people complain about it, I'll say, I understand the general public that's not aware of what roasts are. Because the reality of roasts are, especially for like if you're a 22-year-old kid. The last time there were roasts on television before the Tom Brady roast was literally 10 years ago.

Yeah.

Like, do you remember the Charlie Sheen roast, the Donald Trump roast, the Comedy Central roast? They used to have them all the time.

Yeah, all the time.

They were a long time ago.

Yeah.

It's a long time in the zeitgeist. Yeah. So those things don't exist to kids. To kids, comedy is joking about stuff. Comedy is Chris Rock. Comedy is Kevin Hart. Yeah. Comedy is Louis C.K. That's what they think of comedy is. They don't even understand the jokes. Yeah. that this is roast jokes are fucking mean they've always been fucking mean they can be cruel too personal ruthless go back and watch all those old comedy central ones they were fucking brutal yeah they were brutal patrice would just eviscerate the entire fucking stadium those things the thing is like if you're a person and you're not accustomed to roast and you don't get why those jokes are so I mean, I get it. But comedians, comedians that are getting upset about these roast jokes, fuck all the way off. Just fuck all the way off. All the way? You fucking traitor. All the way off. You know what this is. You know exactly what this is. You're a fucking traitor. You're just using this moment to try to boost yourself up, to try to knock down what's happening. You could disagree with the content. You could say, I think they went too far with this. But this fucking pretending that these people are actual racists and Nazis just because they're telling these jokes that are in a roast, fuck all the way off.

Yeah, don't suit up. Go out and play hockey if you don't want to play hockey. Like, sit on the bench. And don't badmouth the people playing hockey. Yeah, it is what it is. That's the game.

That's the game we're playing. We're playing this ruthless. And by the way, you know who didn't have a problem with it? Kevin fucking Hart. Yeah. Kevin fucking Hart has defended every single person that said horrible shit about him, about him being lynched from a bonsai tree and all the craziest shit that they said.

Well, you know who else didn't have a problem with it is the people, the corporations that put it on corporate television, on corporate airwaves. So there's a whole subsection of the foundation of where these – the platform that they're given, they didn't care about it either or they wouldn't do it.

Well, they knew from the Tom Brady roast how powerful those things are now. The Tom Brady roast was the number one watch thing in Netflix history. Wow. There's more than 55 million people watch that thing.

I got to say, I'm not the hugest fan because I don't love cruel humor as much, but I do love it that that Tom Brady roast, I feel like it kicked wokeness over the cliff, like those buffalo. We were getting so woke, and we needed that roast to sort of course correct.

There's two things that killed woke. Number one, Kid Rock gunned down a whole fucking stack of Bud Light cans. I love that. That was it. That was so good. That might have been it. Oh, that was gorgeous. That might have been it because then they got to see the real financial consequences of being fucking completely insane. Yeah. That people were fed up. They're like, enough. Yeah. And Kid Rock saying, fuck you, Anheuser-Busch. Yeah. That is, that's a big hit to the stock price. And then people realize, oh, this is a micro set of people that are very loud, but it's not the macro. It's not. It's not. It's not the general population.

It's even smaller than micro.

Yeah. It's like micro micro. Not only that, but the people that were in it, a lot of them abandoned ship. Yeah. A lot of them abandoned ship.

Virtue signaling is done.

They just realized they got caught up in a thing that was like the way people were behaving. And so they imitated what was going on in their social groups. It's a normal thing that people do. But it just, it wasn't rational, and that's why it got shot down by Kid Rock.

By the way, what kind of gun did he use? I don't know guns. I bet you know what he used. I think he used an AR.

What's that? If we go back and look at it, it's an assault rifle.

Is it like automatic?

Semi-automatic. I mean, maybe he used it automatic. He's in Tennessee. They have some solid gun laws.

And he just blasted away?

You can kind of have whatever you want there.

How many in a clip for an AR, do you know? It's called a magazine. See, I don't know. Canadian. I don't know anything about guns. They vary. A magazine. They took all your guns up there in Canada. Well, we never had them.

What is he shooting there? Wow, look at that. Yeah. Let's see the video of him doing it, and I can kind of tell you better. That's wild. Kid Rock shoots back at Bud Light. How many views does this have? How many views does this video have?

It's the news reporting of it. I don't mean to.

He didn't post it on YouTube. Look at this. Oh, man. Okay. That's an AR, I think. That's the magazine. But it might be fully automatic. That's not a clip. Let me hear it, please. Yeah, I think that's fully automatic. Yeah, that's fully automatic, 100%. Wow. So he has some kind of machine gun.

i want to go out like i want to shoot up a six pack of dr pepper just for fun i love dr pepper but now i want to shoot some pop why don't you just go shoot something you don't like

because it's kind of symbolic of something you're trying to kill wolves yeah i love wolves you want

to shoot a wolf we're not going back to the depends on where they are forget it if wolves

are in the mountains and they're just being wolves and they're eating elk and deer and i'm all for wolves i'm not an anti-wolf person but i think you shouldn't bring them into residential neighborhoods and drop them off in ranches i think that's fucking ridiculous i'm bringing you back but i think that wolves in the wild are important yeah i'm not an anti-wolf person i just don't like people doing what i call ballot box biology where you get people to decide by voting that are never going to experience these wolves do you think we should reintroduce wolves to colorado and all these people that just got back from whole foods like yeah that would be amazing i heard it was gonna help the sprouts grow and they they vote yes and then these poor lambs are getting eaten alive have you shot a wolf no no i don't want to hunt wolves i don't i mean i would shoot a wolf if i thought the wolf was like endangering my family or trying to kill my dog or something like that but i love wolves i don't not like wolves i think they're awesome i think they're

awesome have you ever heard a wolf howl in the wild no it's very haunting it's very ghostly even more i know you've heard coyotes but a wolf has this long how it's almost i can see why native americans are so spiritually connected to it it's very ghostly and oh yeah it's spiritual almost it's a very beautiful sound no they're amazing animals

That was pretty good Sort of like that

You know if you do that

I had a friend who had wolves I had a friend who had wolves And if you do that in his house they start howling Yeah they go nuts I would go over his house father wow what a wild animal what a crazy noise look they're incredible they're incredible that's so awesome I saw one in the wild and by the way they're important I just don't think you should reintroduce them to fucking aspen you assholes

I don't know it might be fun to see a pack of timbers taking down a skier like charlie sheen coming down the hill with denise richards and you think 12 timberwolves

like take them down and there was a movie rip out there there was a movie about that called frozen not like the let it go oh yeah it was with liam neeson no that was the gray the the frozen movie is a horror movie it's a horror i know all the wolf movies it's a horror movie about these kids that are skiing and they get stuck on a ski lift because they forget they're up there and there's wolves down there okay they get killed so the guy falls and his legs break and then the wolves come

and get him see you're gonna get mad at me but i don't a movie like this one scare me because i just know wolves to be skittish like this you're out of your mind yeah you don't know what you're talking about if you're injured like lions uh leopards jaguars like forget it they'll take you down but my experience with wolves is they're more skittish around humans but i don't want to get into it again we can go to arby's later and have a fight you have a broken leg like that guy did in this movie oh yeah then bleeding and they can smell it okay they're tearing them apart right

now look at watch watch it they're eating them they're eating them they're killing the man is that denise richards no no it looks like drew barry more they live also spoiler no wolves in

new hampshire it's all bullshit yeah there probably was at one point yeah they killed

them all because they were killing people and lifestyle yeah yeah idiots you know how they killed them too most of them they poisoned what they would do is they would inject strychnine into horses and leave the horse carcass and then they would all die wow they did a lot of trapping

too those cruel the oh yeah the snap traps yep they did that too i knew some old uh trap guys up when i worked up north and uh these guys you might not want to hear this but the way they'd take them out is they'd trap them in the leg traps and then they didn't want to damage the pelt so then they walk up to them while they're trapped and they just clunk them they club them to death like how they club seals like that yeah yeah horrible yeah that's i don't like that the clubbing seals man was rough that was rough you ever see those videos and the seals god at least a wolf would run away these seals they're just laying out sunbathing and they walk up and just bam smack and pop their

skulls i know and you're doing that for their fur and the babies they'd smack the babies because they had that beautiful white fur oh my gosh these things are like a chromosome away from being a sex toy they're so cute wow

wolves are good yeah you just don't want them in your neighborhood

they should be in the woods i love them i wouldn't mind if they were around You say that. You say that. Do you have a dog? I've had him.

What if you came out and your dog was getting eaten alive by wolves?

Because they eat dogs. I lost one of my dogs to coyotes. Yeah. I remember the day you told me your pit bull went up and took out a whole squad of coyotes.

No, no, no. It wasn't my pit bull. Oh, I thought it was yours. No, no, no. Your neighbor's? It was one of my friends who worked at a pet store. Oh. He also worked at a veterinarian's office. Oh, okay. And he told me the story about this pit bull that came into the veterinarian's office. It was covered in cuts. A big, big pit bull.

Yeah, you told me this like 10, 15 years ago.

Yeah, it was like one of those, you know, there's these companies that take pit bulls and they breed them and make them like 120 pounds. They keep breeding them bigger and bigger. They look like monsters. This was one of those. This thing was a fucking tank. Like a tank, yeah. And he said it was covered in cuts. And they asked the guy like, what happened? He goes, I don't know. You know, I came home. He was all fucked up and bleeding. So he brings them in, they stitch them up, and then the guy follows the blood trail out into the hills, and he finds nine dead coyotes.

Yeah, I remember you told me that. We were at the store one night, and you told me that you just heard it. I was like, wow. That is the nuttiest fucking story. That story stayed with me, because it was so crazy.

He said it looked like Vietnam. Yeah. He goes, their necks were torn apart, their fucking legs were broken. Because this pit bull, once he grabs a hold of them, he just starts shaking them. Coyotes weigh like 30 pounds. Yeah, they're not super big. But they would do this thing where they would like corner an animal and they would trick it. And the way they would trick it, they would send one animal out there to get chased. Yeah. And so that- Very cunning. The dog would chase it and they would all come in from the sides and tear it apart. Yeah.

They're really smart that way. They fucked with the wrong dude. Yeah. Wow. Isn't that a crazy story? I remember that one. You told me that. I was like, that's crazy. Yeah.

Wow.

Yeah.

They're everywhere now. Coyotes are everywhere. Everywhere. Yeah. Oh, yeah. They're really cool, too. Coyote America, that book by Dan Flores, the same guy who wrote Bison Ecology, Bison Diplomacy, he wrote this amazing book about coyotes where he explains why they're everywhere. Because gray wolves and coyotes don't breed, but red wolves and coyotes do. That's why you have those coy wolves on the East Coast. Yeah. Gray wolves have always killed coyotes. Yeah, yeah. So when gray wolves find coyotes, they kill them. And so coyotes are used to being persecuted by the gray wolves, and then they just keep moving to new places. That's what they do. So that's how they made it all the way across the country. So when people were killing coyotes or people were trying to hunt coyotes, they just moved. They just moved to new places.

Yeah, yeah. And now they're everywhere. They can adapt. I see them in my front lawn almost every other week. Yeah, they're everywhere. Yeah, I'm in the Hollywood Hills, and I see them walking right past my swimming pool.

I mean, it's not cool if you have a dog or a cat, because you will eat them. But they are cool. It's a cool animal. Oh, they're really cool. And their howls are wild, too.

There's these yips in the middle. Well, they go off sometimes if there's a fire engine goes by in Hollywood. The coyotes will react to it and go off.

They also keep the rats down. That's why you don't see a lot of rats. Yeah, that's right. They keep the rat population down. Oh, yeah. If they killed off all the coyotes, it would have a devastating effect for the ecosystem, too. There would be a bunch of shit that would be around all the time now that they're killing and eating. Yeah.

Yeah, no, they're cool animals, man. There was a girl, speaking of being killed by wolves, there was a girl in Prince Edward Island about 12 years ago, I think. She got killed by coyotes. She got killed by a pack of coyotes. Yeah. She was out running with her Walkman on.

She was like a promising folk singer.

Yeah.

They said that those coyotes were unusual because they were used to killing moose. They were killing moose. Yeah, the coyotes would literally, they were going after a bigger game because there wasn't a lot of game there. So they were used to packing together and taking out the moose by attacking their legs. Yeah. Keep cutting at their legs until they can't run.

Wow, I've never heard of coyotes taking out a moose. That's wild.

We looked it up on the show. Wow. This was a very unusual area.

That's strange, yeah.

And it's one of the reasons why they think these coyotes killed this girl. And she wasn't big. She was small. Yeah, she was out jogging. Yeah. But that's the thing man They don't have rules They don't like Well we don't fuck with people And people don't fuck with us But the orcas seem to They seem to understand what we are They've saved people Even out in the wild Like people it fell overboard they've saved them yeah isn't it strange that such a probably the top predator in the sea next to the sperm whale the killer whale could take whatever it wants yeah and somehow instinctively it leaves humans alone i don't really understand it and that's why i talk about sort of the programming of nature to step around humans somehow because it doesn't All of them, though. Humans look like seals with the same body shape, the same weight pretty much. And yet orcas, there's no documented kill of a human by an orca.

I know. Other than SeaWorlds. Yeah. Well, they're so smart. And their brains are huge. They have huge brains. We just equate intelligence with your ability to manipulate your environment. So they don't have a house. They don't have cell phones. They must be idiots. But we don't know. And they clearly understand that we're different than everything else. But that's what I mean. I think all the critters do. Well, we are.

Yeah.

Show some respect, bitch. We're the ones with the guns.

It's biatch.

Biatch. Thank you. I mean, look, we both love animals. Yeah. I know you love animals. I love animals, too. I just love people more.

I love people the same. But if it came to deciding whether we left Earth with humans or animals, I'll be honest. This will sound mean. i'd i'd give it to the animals why because they don't know cruelty that's not true they don't know

that's malice do you know they just listen you're saying you're talking crazy talk do you know how uh bears kill things they just eat them they hold them down they eat them they don't even kill them

first but it's not it's not from cruelty it's for survival it doesn't matter humans are cruel

have you heard of hiroshima yeah i have that was probably less cruel than a bear eating you

asshole first no but there's no intent with a animal and just trying to eat you an animal

doesn't have intent right but the end result's still the same if you you were getting eating asshole first by a grizzly bear you're not thinking well he doesn't have intent to be cruel this is just how he eats me asshole first is his favorite way to go but he has to eat you he can't go to the grocery store he doesn't have to eat you he could kill you first and then eat you like

a cat does but he doesn't know how he doesn't realize he's being cruel we do no no no he doesn't

care right it's not that he doesn't know how he could definitely kill you if you were a bear and they were fighting he would grab you by the neck and he would kill you like they try to kill each other but when they eat you they're not they just don't care right well that's what i mean there's no malice whereas humans but the result is the same you're not going to take comfort in the fact that he doesn't have malice while he's eating your dick uh it's pronounced gourd you know that video uh well the audio of grizzly man getting eaten yeah it's five minutes long oh yeah it's five minutes long of him screaming while this thing's just eating him by grabbing his thighs and pulling chunks out of his thighs by the way they finally just recently released

that audio right because in the movie grizzly man the director refused to play it no it's not real

it's werner herzog he they destroyed that audio yeah the fake audio that's online that's just fake that the new one it's not even new it's been around forever but you listen to it if you know it's fake you hear it you go oh this is bullshit oh it's like it sounds fake yeah yeah yeah it sounds fake yeah but the point is like yeah people are gross and cruel so are chimps you know so what they do to monkeys is fucking horrific yeah you know i don't know if they're doing it on purpose but they what they do to people it seems like they're doing it on purpose when they bite your fingers off and pull your eyeballs out it seems like they're being cruel you know i think it's a primate survival tactic especially like primates that engage in war like chimps engage in war

you develop cruelty in order to be better at your job yeah but i think with them they they lack emotional cruelty cruelty like humans we have we have the knowledge to know something's bad or good they just know survival and we engage in bad right which makes us a different kind of cruel

Yeah, that's a good point.

Yeah. Did I just win my first argument? No, I mean, you're right.

I agree with you about that. We have a certain type of cruelty that's not, you know, it's not like any other animal's cruelty because we're aware of how it's going to affect other people. There you go. Yeah. They're not really aware of it. They just don't care. Yeah. You know when they do those things where they communicate with chimpanzees, they teach them sign language? You know, they've never had a chimp ask a question.

Yeah, right. Interesting. Isn't that interesting? Because they don't care.

But they'd never be like, why are you wearing clothes? You know what I mean?

I never thought of that. Yeah, that's weird, right? Yeah. Can we get Arby's for lunch? Like, why don't they ever ask for anything? They don't ask. Yeah, that's... Well, wait, did... You know what? That's not true.

how so coco the gorilla the gorilla he would ask for affection he would ask for love and hugs i

think there's oh yeah but that's a request that's not a question like why am i here oh okay what is

this building you're talking more of a philosophical question no i'm talking about

having actual curiosity about like its environment right i understand why is your skin white and mine is not what is they're just not aware how come you don't walk on your hands you know there's No, you know what I mean? Like what we call intelligence is very compartmentalized. It's very boxed in in comparison to our intelligence. We have the intelligence to understand this thing probably doesn't like being in the cage. They don't think that way.

Do you believe in the concept of a missing link, like something in between Homo erectus and Neanderthal and then us, modern day? Do you think there's a missing creature?

I think, first of all, the real problem is what's the evidence in terms of the fossil record? It's very incomplete. Right. Because it's hard to get fossils. Right. Like for someone to leave a fossil behind, you have to die in mud or specific conditions. So most animals that die, I think we looked it up before, it's like 99% are never going to leave a fossil. Right. So when they find things like Denisovans, so the Denisovans, I think they found in the 2010s or something like that. When did they find them? Was it more recently than that? Maybe it was more recently than that. So they just found like a tooth and a finger. And then they start finding bones. They're like, hey, this is not like a normal human tooth. This is not like a normal human bone. And then they do DNA tests on them and then they go, oh, this is different. This is a different type of human. So there's humans that lived alongside humans that we just found out about 10 years ago. So how many versions of from ancient hominid to modern homo sapien, how many versions were there that we have evidence of? That's what we don't know. What's the homo or miss it? 2008. Here it is. Michael Shunkoff of the Russian Academy of Sciences and other Russian archaeologists. What happened? We just got scrolled, player. That was weird. We're getting scrawled. What did it just do? That was so weird. That was so weird. It's like they didn't want us reading this out loud. What's the homo we're missing? That's a good question. So archaeologists from the Institute of Archaeology and Ethnography, the Siberian branch of the Russian Academy of Sciences in Novosibirsk Akademgorodok, investigated the cave and found a finger of a juvenile female hominid originally dated from 50,000 to 30,000 years ago. And then the estimate was changed to 76,000 to 51,000 years ago. The specimen was originally named X-Woman. So anyway, the whole thing is they found out this is... Go back that again. A novel ancient hominid genetically distinct from both contemporary modern humans and from neanderthals so they knew from that that it's a new kind of human and that's just 2008 yeah so this is 18 years ago they found that so who knows how many ones they could find if they kept if you had yeah there's a limited amount of archaeologists that are doing this kind of work imagine if you had thousands and thousands of them scouring asia scouring africa looking there's probably a bunch more that we haven't discovered oh definitely so this idea of the missing link I'm not sure if that's accurate. But then the question is—

I'm glad you said that because it sort of illuminated me a little. Yeah. I hadn't thought of it in those terms.

2008, a Taiwanese citizen purchased a fossil homomandible dredged from the seafloor of the Taiwan Strait from an antique shop and donated to Taiwan's National Museum of the National Science. Attempts to extract the DNA were unsuccessful. But in 2025, protein analysis of the specimen designated Pengu 1 was published showing that it belonged to a male Denisovan.

That was just in a shop? I love that a missing link was in an antique shop.

Well, that's how they found Gigantopithecus, too.

I like that old lamp. I'll take that plate. And how about historic missing link? How much is that? What the hell? I think it's just a different kind of person.

Yeah. You know? Interesting. If they kept finding more of them, maybe we'd have a better understanding of what we're talking about. But there's a giant leap, that's for sure. It's the biggest mystery in the entire fossil record is the doubling of the human brain size over a period of 2 million years. It's a nutty thing that happened. All of a sudden our brains grew.

Well, what's interesting to me too is that you do have some fossilized remains that are very, very, very old that date back to caveman era stuff. And then we have stuff closer to what we just looked at, but there's that one transitional, where you'd think there'd be a transitional creature that they can't seem to find.

Well, they might find it. They might. I hope they do. I think some of these are getting closer. They don't have a lot of Denisovan bones, but there's going to be a few more that they find, I'm sure, if they keep looking. I bet there was probably a bunch of different kinds of humans. The question is, like, why did we succeed and why are we so much smarter than all the rest of them?

We should go antiquing this weekend, see what we can dig up.

I don't think it's that way.

Well, according to that, Missing Lowe's in an antique shop. I think that was in China, right? It was a long time ago.

I don't care if they bought China or pottery. I just, let's go in.

I got to wrap this up, buddy. Yeah, buddy. Always good to see you, brother. Great to see you. Thanks for having me, man. Thank you for being here. Wingman, is it available streaming? Is it available everywhere?

it's only streaming uh on apple and amazon prime right now all over the world and then in canada we will start streaming the end of june and they might even do uh 60 to 90 theaters up there so we're excited yeah so yeah dude wingman yeah and good luck with the tony one too that sounds fun yeah and hopefully maybe we'll see you there hopefully maybe yeah and congratulations on

guest of the year that's awesome also oh that was that was last year yeah it was last year thank

you buddy great to see you love you man love you too brother all right bye everybody